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Augustine
04-15-2007, 12:10 AM
Imagine, for a moment, that everything you've always accepted as "reality" is, in fact, a lie perpetuated by Satanic powers; that everything from laws to television programming, wars to fashion trends, are manipulated by forces of Evil; that there is a vast, global conspiracy, paving the way for the Beast and the False Prophet, which shall deceive the nations. My friends, this is not merely a speculation on my part; it is, rather, the world in which we live!

WELCOME TO THE NEW WORLD ORDER.

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-15-2007, 10:48 AM
...and we're supposed to accept that as reality because some know-nothing kid wants to pretend that he has "special" knowledge.

You have no desire to take part in helping make the world a better place, therefore you feed your manufactured delusions so that you may feel that your in some "special club" that accepts "how the world really is".

These things are why you rate a special degree of disdain.

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-15-2007, 10:50 AM
your = you're

Hermes Thoth
04-15-2007, 02:41 PM
...and we're supposed to accept that as reality because some know-nothing kid wants to pretend that he has "special" knowledge.

You have no desire to take part in helping make the world a better place, therefore you feed your manufactured delusions so that you may feel that your in some "special club" that accepts "how the world really is".

These things are why you rate a special degree of disdain.

It is reality. It's happening all around us. Read your bible instead of just pretending you know what's in it.

Cancel5
04-15-2007, 04:35 PM
I've read the Bible a couple of times, real yawner in places, but in other places they have some really graphic stuff...bears mauling children, etc.

I didn't find it as enlightening as some of the modern day scholars writings. The Dali Lama being one such writer.

Augustine
04-15-2007, 05:15 PM
AC,

First off, there is an EDIT feature on this site. Learn to use it.

Second, my knowledge is only 'special' insofar as I am one of few people to seek it and accept it. Ephesians 6:12 says For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. There is a vast, global conspiracy to prepare the world, and society as a whole, for the arrival of the final Antichrist, Petrus Romanus, from the planet Nibiru in the year 2012 AD.

It is understandable that you consider me a fool (although I do not understand why you must be so nasty about it). In the end, however, you will be shown to be the fool, and you will pay an eternal price for it.

Cancel5
04-15-2007, 05:19 PM
AC,

First off, there is an EDIT feature on this site. Learn to use it.

Second, my knowledge is only 'special' insofar as I am one of few people to seek it and accept it. Ephesians 6:12 says For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. There is a vast, global conspiracy to prepare the world, and society as a whole, for the arrival of the final Antichrist, Petrus Romanus, from the planet Nibiru in the year 2012 AD.

It is understandable that you consider me a fool (although I do not understand why you must be so nasty about it). In the end, however, you will be shown to be the fool, and you will pay an eternal price for it.


How do you know that for sure, because supposedly only God truly knows what is the mind of man, according to what the Bible says....and it clearly states that no one should play the role of God.

It amazes me how many godly people and followers of Jesus seem to forget this very thing Yahweh said often and at times brutally.

Augustine
04-15-2007, 05:33 PM
How do you know that for sure, because supposedly only God truly knows what is the mind of man, according to what the Bible says....and it clearly states that no one should play the role of God.

It amazes me how many godly people and followers of Jesus seem to forget this very thing Yahweh said often and at times brutally.

The Bible says if a person rejects the atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ, that person is going to Hell. All people are deserving of Hell. It is only by grace that we are saved. AC, unless he repents and believes in the only begotten Son of God, is going to Hell. This is what the Bible says.

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-15-2007, 07:40 PM
I am so "nasty" about it because you rate it. I am simply showing you the same amount of respect that you show others when you lie through your teeth. I don't lie, so I repay your lack of respect by telling you exactly what a piece of trash you are.

The very fact that you masquerade as a Christian rates nothing but scorn.

Augustine
04-15-2007, 07:45 PM
I am so "nasty" about it because you rate it. I am simply showing you the same amount of respect that you show others when you lie through your teeth. I don't lie, so I repay your lack of respect by telling you exactly what a piece of trash you are.

The very fact that you masquerade as a Christian rates nothing but scorn.

So, basically, when someone believes differently than you, that person is automatically a liar?

Besides, you claim to follow Jesus' teachings; didn't He tell us to love our enemies? How is it "loving" to say that I'm a piece of trash?

uscitizen
04-15-2007, 08:02 PM
Imagine, for a moment, that everything you've always accepted as "reality" is, in fact, a lie perpetuated by Satanic powers; that everything from laws to television programming, wars to fashion trends, are manipulated by forces of Evil; that there is a vast, global conspiracy, paving the way for the Beast and the False Prophet, which shall deceive the nations. My friends, this is not merely a speculation on my part; it is, rather, the world in which we live!

WELCOME TO THE NEW WORLD ORDER.

Everything would have to include God, Heaven, hell, etc as well....
Ohh but then I am sure you mean everything except those things ;)

uscitizen
04-15-2007, 08:04 PM
It is reality. It's happening all around us. Read your bible instead of just pretending you know what's in it.

but what if the bible is part of the everything ?

uscitizen
04-15-2007, 08:05 PM
So, basically, when someone believes differently than you, that person is automatically a liar?

Besides, you claim to follow Jesus' teachings; didn't He tell us to love our enemies? How is it "loving" to say that I'm a piece of trash?

But then is is correct for you to judge someone as evil ?

Augustine
04-15-2007, 08:42 PM
But then is is correct for you to judge someone as evil ?

Everyone is evil. But no, it was not correct for me to single out AC as being evil. However, it is correct to rebuke him for his rudeness. AC is notoriously rude. He viciously attacks people, unprovoked, simply for disagreeing with him.

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-15-2007, 09:46 PM
I attack YOU Brent, because of how YOU behave. I don't call you a liar because you have different beliefs. I call you a liar BECAUSE YOU LIE.

Augustine
04-15-2007, 09:55 PM
I attack YOU Brent, because of how YOU behave.

Okay. Can you cite a specific example?


YOU LIE.

Prove it.

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-15-2007, 10:25 PM
I did already. I point out how The Bible condones slavery. You claim it does not. I show EXACTLY how it does PRECISELY what I stated. You pretend that I did nothing of the sort.

You have ZERO integrity, kiddo.

Augustine
04-15-2007, 10:37 PM
I did already. I point out how The Bible condones slavery. You claim it does not. I show EXACTLY how it does PRECISELY what I stated. You pretend that I did nothing of the sort.

I don't have to pretend anything. I simply don't view it as condoning slavery. It is a regulation of slavery, yes, implying a tolerance of slavery; but not an endorsement of the practice.

Besides, you have been nasty toward me from the beginning.

You attack people for what they believe, unprovoked, every day.


You have ZERO integrity, kiddo.

Pot calling kettle.

uscitizen
04-16-2007, 07:16 AM
Everyone is evil. But no, it was not correct for me to single out AC as being evil. However, it is correct to rebuke him for his rudeness. AC is notoriously rude. He viciously attacks people, unprovoked, simply for disagreeing with him.

Everyone is evil ? Could you be confusing sinners with evil ?

And here I thought I was a negative kind of guy....

Augustine
04-16-2007, 05:50 PM
Everyone is evil ? Could you be confusing sinners with evil ?

And here I thought I was a negative kind of guy....

Sin is evil.

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-16-2007, 06:40 PM
I treat dishonest people with scorn. I disagree with most of the Libertarians on many counts, but do not have any reason to speak ill of them. YOU, Brent, are a dishonest piece of shit, and you refuse to change your ways.

I will continue to point out what a piece of garbage you are, so long as you act like a piece of garbage.

Beefy
04-16-2007, 07:26 PM
I treat dishonest people with scorn. I disagree with most of the Libertarians on many counts, but do not have any reason to speak ill of them. YOU, Brent, are a dishonest piece of shit, and you refuse to change your ways.

I will continue to point out what a piece of garbage you are, so long as you act like a piece of garbage.

His majesty is the sole arbitor of what is, and what isn't garbage Brent. You've been barking up the wrong tree in all your Jesus worship, it is AC whose ass you should be kissing and fearing at the same time instead.

Augustine
04-16-2007, 07:42 PM
AC,

Do you honestly believe I care what you think of me?

You're 36 or 37 years old, unmarried, obese, sexually frustrated, and probably still living with the folks. As a manager in retail, I meet people like you ALL the time. You've had no success with women, and you're jealous of younger men. That, and you probably have no career.

Consider this "customer from hell" story of mine:


This happened a few weeks ago, during the early morning hours. I was heading toward the back of the store to put up some signage, a few minutes passed by, and the cashier called for backup. I proceeded to the front of the store, and an old man came to my register.

I asked if he has a customer card, to which he responded, "No, and I don't want one. I've spent 10 minutes in this goddamned line and now I just want to get the hell out of your goddamned store." In respond, "Ok sir," treating him as if he is a normal person. (It should be noted that only 2 minutes passed by, not 10, as there was no line when I left the customer service desk a couple of minutes prior. I knew there was no way I could reason with the customer so I let him "win"). The man purchased one item; it totaled to $11.40 with tax. He handed me a $50 bill and 40 cents. I counted his change ($39) in tens, fives, and four ones and stacked the money neatly before him. He said, "Great, now I have to recount the change since you can't count it right." I watched as he counted the change, smiling the whole time. "Did I count it correctly sir?" I asked politely. He responded sharply, "Yeah I guess you did," yanked the receipt out of my hand, and yells, "Let me tell you, you're one of the most sarcastic sons of bitches I've ever met!"

I reply, "What exactly did I do wrong sir?" He replies, "You know exactly what you did wrong you little bastard. I spent fifteen goddamned minutes in the line while you took your time, you can't count the damn change correctly (this after admitting I did count it correctly),... followed by a stream of profane insults, which I fail to recollect. Then he asked to see a manager. When I told him I am the manager on duty, he barged out of the store. I chuckled.

In other news, the next morning a customer told the GM to "go fuck herself" because she would not return a half-empty toner with no receipt and no way of proving it was purchased for $150 as the customer claimed. (It rang up for $15). Clearly a dumpster-dive.

You're a prick just like the customers in my story above.

That's why you, unlike "normal" liberals, cannot disagree on a civil basis.

Beefy
04-16-2007, 07:52 PM
AC,

Do you honestly believe I care what you think of me?

You're 36 or 37 years old, unmarried, obese, sexually frustrated, and probably still living with the folks. As a manager in retail, I meet people like you ALL the time. You've had no success with women, and you're jealous of younger men. That, and you probably have no career.

Consider this "customer from hell" story of mine:



You're a prick just like the customers in my story above.

That's why you, unlike "normal" liberals, cannot disagree on a civil basis.


Taht customer of yours has nothing to do with his highness. You know, he's gonna go "logical fallacy" on your ass for that one.

Damocles
04-16-2007, 07:55 PM
Sin is evil.
But people are not sin. Their action may be evil but the person is not. God cannot abide sin, at least according to your book he cannot, yet he can cleanse you of the sin. Were you, yourself, the sin or "evil" there would be no way to cleanse you. The only option would be to destroy you.

Come on, Augustine... Sometimes even you might have simply misstated yourself. People are not "evil", evil is something they do, but they themselves are not "evil".

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-16-2007, 08:02 PM
I admit that my desire to repay you shows how I fail.

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-16-2007, 08:05 PM
Even in admitting my failure, I still seek to best you. To be blunt, I know you are a joke when compared to my prowess. You are no competition, Brent. Nonetheless, I still haven't mastered myself.

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-16-2007, 08:07 PM
Brent, are you capable of accepting your disgusting behavior?

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-16-2007, 08:10 PM
A wise sportsman once said that the best defense is a good offense. That works fine if your goal is to destroy your enemy.

Augustine
04-16-2007, 08:23 PM
Even in admitting my failure, I still seek to best you. To be blunt, I know you are a joke when compared to my prowess. You are no competition, Brent. Nonetheless, I still haven't mastered myself.

Your humility is astounding, to say the least.


Brent, are you capable of accepting your disgusting behavior?

Few people (even on this site) would consider my behavior 'disgusting' when compared to your hate-driven personal attacks.


A wise sportsman once said that the best defense is a good offense. That works fine if your goal is to destroy your enemy.

I have no desire to destroy you. I only wish you could be a nice person, for your own benefit as well as that of others. Also, unlike you, I do not hold the internet on par with real life.

http://www.hfstival.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10148/normal_Internet-SeriousBusiness.jpg

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-16-2007, 08:32 PM
Nice picture. It clearly shows what you desire.

Plain and simple Brent... My argument is rock-solid. Your argument is hopelessly lame.

I know that I go a bit over-the-top in my anger towards liars like yourself. I let anger get the better of me. You claim the high road, then try to dispatch your enemy with insults, as you are complaining about how your enemy is doing the very thing you are complaining about.

THINK.

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-16-2007, 08:35 PM
I am humble, but not unrealistic. You simply aren't a real challenge for me. I've wasted my time thrashing far better than you for years. You're a lamb in wolf's clothing (rather, a grade school facsimile of wolf's clothing).

Augustine
04-16-2007, 08:36 PM
Plain and simple Brent... My argument is rock-solid. Your argument is hopelessly lame.

So what if it were? How does having a 'better argument' in a debate justify wishing to wrap your hands around my neck and strangle me, as you expressed in a PM to me?


I know that I go a bit over-the-top in my anger towards liars like yourself. I let anger get the better of me. You claim the high road, then try to dispatch your enemy with insults, as you are complaining about how your enemy is doing the very thing you are complaining about.

THINK.

Your problem, ultimately, is that you make no distinction between 'lie' and disagreement. One cannot disagree with you, and NOT be a liar, according to your logic.


I know that I go a bit over-the-top in my anger towards liars like yourself.

Why are you angry? Dude, this is the INTERNET. People are ALWAYS going to disagree with you. GET OVER IT, AND GET A LIFE, YOU PATHETIC LOSER!

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-16-2007, 08:37 PM
rather, the very same thing you are doing.

Augustine
04-16-2007, 08:38 PM
I am humble,

Bullshit.

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-16-2007, 08:39 PM
Here's a clue...when you enter into debate, you are to eschew dishonest argument tactics. Claiming "This is just the internet" is nothing more than saying that you have no honest argument, and you feel the need to engage in dishonest argument tactics so as to feel as if you are correct.

Plain and simple, Brent:

You have no serious arguments, and you hate those who actually do.

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-16-2007, 08:41 PM
Leviticus shows that "God" condoned slavery.


You refuse to accept that FACT.


Spin your way out of that, deceiver.

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-16-2007, 08:42 PM
Buy your Bondmen from this group of people = Condoning slavery...PERIOD.


Go back to bed.

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-16-2007, 08:42 PM
Let the spin begin

uscitizen
04-16-2007, 08:55 PM
Brent needs to study the definitions of condone a bit....

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-16-2007, 09:41 PM
Brent is a liar and a coward.

AnyOldIron
04-17-2007, 02:46 AM
So, basically, when someone believes differently than you, that person is automatically a liar?

That's not what anyone is saying. It is a matter of philosophical integrity.

You argue from a position of 'truth by authority'. You don't present any form of reasoning, you simply quote or paraphrase the bible and state that this is truth as it 'says so in the bible'.

You imply that AC is arrogant in his argument, yet there is nothing more arrogant than 'truth by authority', in the assumption that that you invest the authority (ie the bible) is infallible and that you can merely parrot the conclusion without knowing or even having any premises to support the conclusion. This is how religion and reason are incompatible, you cannot have 'truth by authority' and reason at the same time....

AnyOldIron
04-17-2007, 03:21 AM
Brent is a liar and a coward.

Just young and misguided. With the number of conmen preachers in the US it isn't surprising young men like Brent, desperate to find some meaning and significance in their lives, buy into sophist arguments such as those he has.

It is, in my opinion, why the teaching of philosophy to a higher degree should be included in education, starting at a very young age.....

uscitizen
04-17-2007, 06:32 AM
It is, in my opinion, why the teaching of philosophy to a higher degree should be included in education, starting at a very young age.....
//
That would be books that are banned in school libraries over here.
The religious right are loud whiners.

AnyOldIron
04-17-2007, 06:48 AM
That would be books that are banned in school libraries over here.

Wow, what books are banned?

uscitizen
04-17-2007, 07:08 AM
That would be books that are banned in school libraries over here.

Wow, what books are banned?

In School libraries not college, yes.

Damocles
04-17-2007, 08:23 AM
It is, in my opinion, why the teaching of philosophy to a higher degree should be included in education, starting at a very young age.....
//
That would be books that are banned in school libraries over here.
The religious right are loud whiners.
So are the PC Left. Banning Tom Sawyer for gawd's sake! It had "racist language". To Kill a Mockingbird? Racist? It was written as an argument against racism...

I always love it when people only blame the religious for such things. Clearly the secular humanist nutjobs can be equally blamed for it.

AnyOldIron
04-17-2007, 08:50 AM
I always love it when people only blame the religious for such things. Clearly the secular humanist nutjobs can be equally blamed for it.

You get lunatics and non-thinkers amongst all groups, just they are far more concentrated amongst the religious. Its just that religion encourages it.

Cypress
04-17-2007, 08:53 AM
Imagine, for a moment, that everything you've always accepted as "reality" is, in fact, a lie perpetuated by Satanic powers; that everything from laws to television programming, wars to fashion trends, are manipulated by forces of Evil; that there is a vast, global conspiracy, paving the way for the Beast and the False Prophet, which shall deceive the nations. My friends, this is not merely a speculation on my part; it is, rather, the world in which we live! WELCOME TO THE NEW WORLD ORDER.


"Imagine, for a moment, that everything you've always accepted as "reality" is, in fact, a lie perpetuated by Satanic powers"

Imagine for a moment, that a qualified psychiatrist puts you on lithium or prozac, and the delusions in your head are minimized so that you can lead some sort of semblance of a normal life.

Damocles
04-17-2007, 08:58 AM
I always love it when people only blame the religious for such things. Clearly the secular humanist nutjobs can be equally blamed for it.

You get lunatics and non-thinkers amongst all groups, just they are far more concentrated amongst the religious. Its just that religion encourages it.
I think they have larger numbers, here specifically, because there are more of them. When 90% of a nation professes a belief in Christianity, then most of your nutjobs will be Christian. That doesn't make it any less wrong to take books from the library that are somehow considered "anti" whatever your group is.

uscitizen
04-17-2007, 01:19 PM
So are the PC Left. Banning Tom Sawyer for gawd's sake! It had "racist language". To Kill a Mockingbird? Racist? It was written as an argument against racism...

I always love it when people only blame the religious for such things. Clearly the secular humanist nutjobs can be equally blamed for it.

I did not exclude the left fringes either. I just did not mention them.
As always extremeists of all varieties are wrong.

uscitizen
04-17-2007, 01:20 PM
I thought it was more like 75% claiming to be Christians...

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-17-2007, 08:25 PM
Most of the Christians I know are utilitarians.

That would seem "okay", but for the fat that utilitarians have some epistemological problems. Fortunately, their epistemological problems don't impact everyday life too much.

It is the radical fundamentalists that one needs to worry about.

IHateGovernment
04-17-2007, 10:40 PM
I don't care for utilitarianism being the mainstay of one's philsophical life practice.

Augustine
04-17-2007, 11:54 PM
That would be books that are banned in school libraries over here.

Wow, what books are banned?

Some books are so filthy and/or anti-American it deserves to be burned...

Augustine
04-17-2007, 11:55 PM
This message is hidden because Agnosticus_Caesar is on your ignore list.

Much better!

AnyOldIron
04-18-2007, 04:40 AM
Some books are so filthy and/or anti-American it deserves to be burned...

How would you feel if someone decided that the bible was filthy and anti-American and that it deserved to be burned?

Isn't freedom of speech one of the principles that America was built upon? Does your desire to burn books that don't subscribe to your world view make YOU un-American? Should we burn you?

AnyOldIron
04-18-2007, 04:45 AM
Much better!

Why would you put anyone on the ignore list? Do opposing ideas worry you so much?

uscitizen
04-18-2007, 06:19 AM
Some books are so filthy and/or anti-American it deserves to be burned...
What about that book in the bible about David's escapades ? Pretty risque....

Augustine
04-18-2007, 01:01 PM
AnyOldIron,

In case you didn't notice, YOU are not on my ignore list.

I am fine with opposing viewpoints. What I hate is being harassed and hate-smeared unprovoked, EVERY DAY, by Agnosticus_Caesar. I don't have time for that crap.

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-18-2007, 08:55 PM
I only recently starting posting again. I will admit this:

I almost always make negative comments about Brent, when I see activity from him. This is because he has ZERO integrity, and i cannot help but point out his dishonesty.

DEBATE should be DEBATE. if you want to PRETEND to debate, while using OBVIOUS logical fallacies, you will be called on it.

What Brent is doing is tantamount to stepping into a boxing ring, then whining when people HIT him.

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-18-2007, 08:56 PM
Worse yet, it amounts to him complaining about LEGAL punches, when he throws nothing but head butts and low blows.

AnyOldIron
04-19-2007, 02:00 AM
What I hate is being harassed and hate-smeared unprovoked, EVERY DAY, by Agnosticus_Caesar. I don't have time for that crap.

AC might not be the most genial of debators on this subject but he makes very good points and you should listen to him. Remember the old adage, 'sticks and stones...'

FUCK THE POLICE
04-20-2007, 09:25 PM
The Bible says if a person rejects the atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ, that person is going to Hell. All people are deserving of Hell. It is only by grace that we are saved. AC, unless he repents and believes in the only begotten Son of God, is going to Hell. This is what the Bible says.

Why is AC going to hell because he hasn't accepted one of the begotten sons of God?

FUCK THE POLICE
04-20-2007, 09:27 PM
So, basically, when someone believes differently than you, that person is automatically a liar?

Besides, you claim to follow Jesus' teachings; didn't He tell us to love our enemies? How is it "loving" to say that I'm a piece of trash?

Why are you right?

You have said this. But statements without evidence aren't very convincing. For instance, "I am Lindsay Lohan" is outragous. It's slightly less outrageous than you claiming that there's a bunch of middle-aged men sitting in their evil lair, cackling and just waiting to spread evil, but let's ignore that. I could provide you with pictures of myself and send them to you over the internet. Why won't you accept my proof that I am Lindsay Lohan, with these pictures? Do you not seek the truth?

FUCK THE POLICE
04-20-2007, 09:29 PM
Everyone is evil. But no, it was not correct for me to single out AC as being evil. However, it is correct to rebuke him for his rudeness. AC is notoriously rude. He viciously attacks people, unprovoked, simply for disagreeing with him.

No one is evil. Evil is an emotional tag people put on other people whenever they refuse to understand them and wall them up with indifference.

FUCK THE POLICE
04-20-2007, 09:56 PM
"Imagine, for a moment, that everything you've always accepted as "reality" is, in fact, a lie perpetuated by Satanic powers"

Imagine for a moment, that a qualified psychiatrist puts you on lithium or prozac, and the delusions in your head are minimized so that you can lead some sort of semblance of a normal life.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olanzapine

Zyprexia, one of the most popular anti-psychotics in the US, would be more appropriate. Read and learn Brent. Go to a psychaitrist and ask for an anti-psychotic.

FUCK THE POLICE
04-20-2007, 09:57 PM
Actually, you should take lithium and an antipsychotic. Why not, huh? It'll be fun. You'll probably see colors.

FUCK THE POLICE
04-20-2007, 09:58 PM
I thought it was more like 75% claiming to be Christians...

No, it's about 85% now. Both evangelicism and atheism are growing at exponential rates, however.

uscitizen
04-21-2007, 06:22 AM
No, it's about 85% now. Both evangelicism and atheism are growing at exponential rates, however.

No suprise considering the show the religious right has been putting on in recent years.

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-22-2007, 10:43 PM
What Brent doesn't seem to comprehend is that I put more faith in the message of Jesus than he probably ever will.

uscitizen
04-23-2007, 11:41 AM
What Brent doesn't seem to comprehend is that I put more faith in the message of Jesus than he probably ever will.

good for You AC. Brent cannot see the forest for the trees.

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-23-2007, 09:08 PM
Jesus taught that we need to stop focusing on the law, and pay attention to the message. Brent and his ilk are nothing more than modern day Pharisees.

uscitizen
04-24-2007, 04:54 AM
Nope, Brent is just plain nuts. And needs professional help.

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-24-2007, 08:35 PM
Brent is a product of the modern Christian Fundamentalist movement. They need unthinking self-sycophants like him. He and his ilk keep them well fed.

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-24-2007, 08:36 PM
Anti-Christ "Christians". It's nauseating.

Agnosticus_Caesar
04-24-2007, 08:38 PM
The "Anti-Christ" isn't about forming legions who think the hate Jesus. It's about legions who claim Jesus in their own name.

uscitizen
04-25-2007, 05:35 AM
Those who use Religion instead of following it.

Agnosticus_Caesar
05-01-2007, 08:53 PM
yet, I'm still guilty

uscitizen
05-02-2007, 05:31 AM
Guilt is a powerful tool to control.

Hermes Thoth
05-02-2007, 04:17 PM
Most evangelicals are not real christians, as they still believe in the superiority and special covenant of the jews, and are excited about the reestablishment of the sanhedrin. Jesus was against the rabbinic power structure; these evangelicals are jew worshippers, however.

Damocles
05-02-2007, 06:28 PM
I've always thought that they were just attempting to bring on the end of the world. How can the temple be rebuilt for the anti-Christ to defile if there is no Jewish state?

uscitizen
05-02-2007, 06:51 PM
It will be rebuilt in Missouri by Mitt for Jesus's second coming ;)

Hermes Thoth
05-03-2007, 07:23 PM
I've always thought that they were just attempting to bring on the end of the world. How can the temple be rebuilt for the anti-Christ to defile if there is no Jewish state?


It is not a duty of christians to HASTEN what is in the book of revelations. That is the work of the synagogue of satan, and the confused noahides who have replaced goodness in their hearts with worldy power.

A hierarchical structure is truly not the most beneficial one for humanity, it's just where we have come from. There will be a tidal change in humanity, when jesus comes to destroy the evil control structure the jews are building.

Damocles
05-03-2007, 08:29 PM
It is not a duty of christians to HASTEN what is in the book of revelations. That is the work of the synagogue of satan, and the confused noahides who have replaced goodness in their hearts with worldy power.

A hierarchical structure is truly not the most beneficial one for humanity, it's just where we have come from. There will be a tidal change in humanity, when jesus comes to destroy the evil control structure the jews are building.
I'm not disagreeing with you (nor agreeing for that matter), nor did I ever say it was anybody's "duty" to hasten prophesy. I am pointing out what I think is a more likely motive for those that might be working to keep Israel on the map. I certainly don't believe it is because they worship jews or that jews run the show. I just think that many of them believe that the end times are coming and their pastors are likely to want them to think that.

I know the church I grew up in spent a ton of time attempting to convert them to christianity because they feared that they would end up in hell because they didn't accept Christ.

uscitizen
05-04-2007, 05:48 AM
Would Christianity even exist if not for the fear of hell or the promise of eternal life ?

Hermes Thoth
05-06-2007, 07:10 AM
I'm not disagreeing with you (nor agreeing for that matter), nor did I ever say it was anybody's "duty" to hasten prophesy. I am pointing out what I think is a more likely motive for those that might be working to keep Israel on the map. I certainly don't believe it is because they worship jews or that jews run the show. I just think that many of them believe that the end times are coming and their pastors are likely to want them to think that.

I know the church I grew up in spent a ton of time attempting to convert them to christianity because they feared that they would end up in hell because they didn't accept Christ.


Right. And I'm saying that motivation is a misinterpretation of christian purpose. And many christians do still believe that jews have a special covenant with god still, to this day. They reject the classic christian concept of a NEW covenant for all of humanity through christ.

uscitizen
05-06-2007, 07:31 AM
AHZ in my observation MOST Christians accept that the Jews are the chosen of God. It says so in the Bible that Christians use and believe.

Hermes Thoth
05-06-2007, 07:40 AM
AHZ in my observation MOST Christians accept that the Jews are the chosen of God. It says so in the Bible that Christians use and believe.

But that actual teaching is that they WERE the chosen of god, but with jesus there is a NEW covenant for ALL OF HUMANITY, including the jews. But you're right, many christians have forgotten the whole meaning of the new testament. That's whey they're actually noahides: Non jews, who worship the god of israel, and take a subservient role to jews.

uscitizen
05-06-2007, 07:55 AM
Yeah well Jesus was a JEW, trained in the templa and all that. Yes he was a rebel Jew but a Jew none the less. Acciording to the Bible his father is the same God as the God of Abraham and Islam as well.

Jesus just promoted humanitarianism and a way to heaven that bypassed the jewish beaucracy.

In a way jesus founded the first church of discount worship ;)

Hermes Thoth
05-06-2007, 08:12 AM
Yeah well Jesus was a JEW, trained in the templa and all that. Yes he was a rebel Jew but a Jew none the less. Acciording to the Bible his father is the same God as the God of Abraham and Islam as well.

Jesus just promoted humanitarianism and a way to heaven that bypassed the jewish beaucracy.

In a way jesus founded the first church of discount worship ;)


And he taught that salvation was not race based. that ALL are chosen who accept him.

uscitizen
05-06-2007, 08:15 AM
Yep and that did not endear him to those that ran the temple either.

TRGLDTE
05-06-2007, 09:58 PM
AC,

First off, there is an EDIT feature on this site. Learn to use it.

Second, my knowledge is only 'special' insofar as I am one of few people to seek it and accept it. Ephesians 6:12 says For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. There is a vast, global conspiracy to prepare the world, and society as a whole, for the arrival of the final Antichrist, Petrus Romanus, from the planet Nibiru in the year 2012 AD.

It is understandable that you consider me a fool (although I do not understand why you must be so nasty about it). In the end, however, you will be shown to be the fool, and you will pay an eternal price for it.

It is interesting to note that 2012 is the end of the "Long cycle" in the Mayan calendar. The end of the long cycle culminates in some major disastrous event.

TRGLDTE
05-06-2007, 10:01 PM
Everyone is evil. But no, it was not correct for me to single out AC as being evil. However, it is correct to rebuke him for his rudeness. AC is notoriously rude. He viciously attacks people, unprovoked, simply for disagreeing with him. WOW, Brent agreeing with pagan Mayans and preaching right from Mithraic belief systems!

uscitizen
05-07-2007, 06:18 AM
It is interesting to note that 2012 is the end of the "Long cycle" in the Mayan calendar. The end of the long cycle culminates in some major disastrous event.

Hmm and the Mayans not even around to see it....
Maybe it happened early ?

TRGLDTE
05-07-2007, 11:16 AM
Hmm and the Mayans not even around to see it....
Maybe it happened early ? That should have been "a Long cycle" as opposed to "the Long cycle."

OrnotBitwise
05-10-2007, 10:33 AM
I think more things need to be placed on top of other things.

uscitizen
05-10-2007, 11:40 AM
I think more things need to be placed on top of other things.
Like on the I rack ?

Augustine
05-12-2007, 11:08 PM
Would Christianity even exist if not for the fear of hell or the promise of eternal life ?

If Hell is not a real place, Christianity is not real to begin with.

The existence of a Holy God requires a Hell, as punishment for sin. Unless your sins were punished in Christ, your sins will be punished in you! It is this simple Biblical principle which requires the existence of a place known as Hell.

Hell is a fearsome, terrible place. It brings tears to my eyes when I think of it. I don't wish that ANYONE would go there, but that ALL would repent.

Augustine
05-12-2007, 11:11 PM
USCitizen,

Jesus died on the Cross so that all who profess faith in His name would be counted as righteous on the day of judgment. I pray you will be standing amongst the Elect on that glorious day. Once sinners, now glorified; we will stand together before the Lord, cleansed in the precious blood of Jesus. :)

Agnosticus_Caesar
05-13-2007, 01:30 AM
What radical fundamentalists like Brent fail to understand is that "The second coming of Christ" is an INDIVIDUAL thing. Acceptance of the message that Jesus spread is his "second coming". it is exactly the same thing as "accepting Jesus".

Brent, and his ilk think that there is some MAGIC consequence to claiming to accept Jesus. They fail to understand that the power of Jesus IS his message, not his blood, flesh, or magical power.

His divinity lies in the choices he made...the message he embraced. the same message we all know about, but only choose to accept to varying degrees.

Augustine
05-16-2007, 07:36 PM
Brent, and his ilk think that there is some MAGIC consequence to claiming to accept Jesus.

It is not magic, but the power of God.


They fail to understand that the power of Jesus IS his message, not his blood, flesh, or magical power.

You are a foolish man. Jesus' words are simple to understand, for those who are willing to hear it.

Jesus taught, For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. 18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. (John 3:16-18)

What is this God of whom Christ speaks?

You do not even believe in God, you fool.


not his blood,

Wrong.

Matthew 26:27-29 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it; 28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins. 29 But I say unto you, I will not drink henceforth of this fruit of the vine, until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father's kingdom.

According to Jesus' own words, He died for our sins. This is consistent with the words of Paul: Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: 25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; 26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus. (Romans 3:24-26)

I recommend you actually read the Bible sometime.


not his ... flesh

Wrong.

Luke 22:19 And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me.

John 6:35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.

The Lord's Supper is taken in rememberance of Christ's atoning sacrifice. Christ's blood was shed for our sins. As Isaiah the prophet wrote, "he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed." For your information, this was written hundreds of years prior to Christ.


or magical power.

Why do you insist on misrepresenting Christian belief? You are as much of a liar as you are vicious.


His divinity lies in the choices he made...the message he embraced.

Jesus is the Son of God, and God the Son; He is an eternal being.

John 8:57-59 Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham? 58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am. 59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

John 20:28-29 And Thomas answered and said unto him, My LORD and my God. 29 Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.

The teaching of Jesus is to repent and believe. From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand. (Matthew 4:17)

Those who believe will receive eternal life; those who reject the only begotten Son of God will receive everlasting punishment. As Christ preached, He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. (Mark 16:16) And, I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture. (John 10:9) And, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. (John 14:6) Shall I continue?

Yet you do not even believe in God, nor in Heaven or Hell.

I recommend you carefully consider what I have said. If you are correct, I have little to worry about. But if I am correct that the Bible is true, and I am firmly convicted it is, then you will burn in Hell. Are you willing to run the risk?

Turn away from your wickedness and receive forgiveness in Jesus Christ. As Romans 10:9 says, if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. Settle it now, AC.

Regards,
Brent

uscitizen
05-16-2007, 08:09 PM
Whare ya been Brent ? Been missin ya boy.

AnyOldIron
05-17-2007, 05:04 AM
If you are correct, I have little to worry about. But if I am correct that the Bible is true, and I am firmly convicted it is, then you will burn in Hell. Are you willing to run the risk?


Pascal's cowardly wager?

I could reverse that for you.

If an afterlife doesn't exist, then the only legacy you have are your genetic imprint and your actions, how you affect society.

What if you spend your life not achieving great things, not living life to its full extent but dedicating your life to worshipping a fictional character. If you are wrong about religion you are wasting the one brief glimpse of existence open to you.

uscitizen
05-17-2007, 05:59 AM
"If you are correct, I have little to worry about. But if I am correct that the Bible is true, and I am firmly convicted it is, then you will burn in Hell. Are you willing to run the risk?"

Of course I am. I figure it to be the same risk as that of getting invaded by faeries from middle earth.

How can I fear something I do not believe in ?

Battleborne
05-24-2007, 11:20 AM
"If you are correct, I have little to worry about. But if I am correct that the Bible is true, and I am firmly convicted it is, then you will burn in Hell. Are you willing to run the risk?"

Of course I am. I figure it to be the same risk as that of getting invaded by faeries from middle earth.

How can I fear something I do not believe in ?

this thread???...Never mind this is too good to pass up...uhhhh...USC I think your geography is off base...don't you mean "faeries" from San Franciso and NYC...so do they or do they not exist...that is the question you need to ponder...:tongout: Y'all Lib's really need to make up your minds!

uscitizen
05-24-2007, 12:13 PM
LOL, I see your point, but am not very homophobic.
I consider CA to be like a bowl of Granola, what isn't fruits and flakes are nuts.

And on NY well any farmer knows what will happen when you put too many critters in a small pen.

Battleborne
05-24-2007, 04:33 PM
LOL, I see your point, but am not very homophobic.
I consider CA to be like a bowl of Granola, what isn't fruits and flakes are nuts.

And on NY well any farmer knows what will happen when you put too many critters in a small pen.


Ya think??? :clink:

TheStripey1
05-31-2007, 02:20 PM
How do you know that for sure, because supposedly only God truly knows what is the mind of man, according to what the Bible says....and it clearly states that no one should play the role of God.

It amazes me how many godly people and followers of Jesus seem to forget this very thing Yahweh said often and at times brutally.



perhaps it is because they aren't actually followers of Christ... that they're just giving lip service to His teachings.

TheStripey1
05-31-2007, 02:23 PM
So, basically, when someone believes differently than you, that person is automatically a liar?

Besides, you claim to follow Jesus' teachings; didn't He tell us to love our enemies? How is it "loving" to say that I'm a piece of trash?

Perhaps you should reread the part in the New Testement about judging others... as that's part of Christ's teachings too...

TheStripey1
05-31-2007, 02:28 PM
It will be rebuilt in Missouri by Mitt for Jesus's second coming ;)

shouldn't that be Utah?

TheStripey1
05-31-2007, 02:31 PM
It is interesting to note that 2012 is the end of the "Long cycle" in the Mayan calendar. The end of the long cycle culminates in some major disastrous event.

an asteroid perhaps...

TheStripey1
05-31-2007, 02:39 PM
so what started out as a New World Order conspiracy theory, turned out to be nothing more than a Biblical rant...

Agnosticus_Caesar
05-31-2007, 08:11 PM
I think Jesus was right, for the most part. Pharisees, such as Brent, chafe at such thoughts.

Agnosticus_Caesar
05-31-2007, 08:12 PM
BTW Brent, I also give Satan the time of day. Do you?

Augustine
06-02-2007, 03:11 AM
I think Jesus was right, for the most part.

Really?

Jesus preached of the Father (God), the Kingdom, repentance, judgment, as well as love and peace. You know nothing of these. Not only are you are a bitter, haughty person, you do not even believe in God. So tell me, what is this God of whom Christ speaks? You are a foolish man. Though you are quite smug, you will bow in the presence of a Holy God. I assure you standing will not be an option. You will bow, and shout JESUS IS LORD. But my friend it will be too late for you. That is, unless you repent now and turn to the Lord. Jesus taught, "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16) Jesus is the ONLY WAY to be saved. As He preached, "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me." (John 14:6) If you reject the only begotten Son of God, He will reject you. "Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels [...], And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal." (Matthew 25:41, 46)

Set aside your pride, and ponder what I have said. Repent now and receive the Lord Jesus. Otherwise, you will burn in Hell forever. This is the just punishment for us all. Yet for those of us who are justified in Christ, we shall be counted as righteous before God. Why not settle it now?

Regards,
Brent

Agnosticus_Caesar
06-03-2007, 09:51 PM
I accept Jesus.

Agnosticus_Caesar
06-03-2007, 09:52 PM
Are you certain you do?

Damocles
06-03-2007, 09:54 PM
I accept Jesus.
As what?

Agnosticus_Caesar
06-03-2007, 09:58 PM
As Jesus.

Agnosticus_Caesar
06-03-2007, 09:59 PM
What more should I accept him as?

Damocles
06-03-2007, 10:17 PM
As Jesus.
As God? As you clearly know that Brent is speaking of?

That was my question.

Damocles
06-03-2007, 10:21 PM
As your "personal savior"... So forth. You know what Brent speaks of and act as if you don't.

Agnosticus_Caesar
06-03-2007, 10:50 PM
I act as I think is fit. Jesus didn't claim to be God. In fact, he went out of his way to state otherwise.

The "miracle" of Jesus has nothing to do with direct interference of the deity. The "miracle" is that Jesus acted in such a way that those of us who cannot overcome our animal nature would think should REQUIRE divine intervention.

Jesus became THE son of God, while surrounded by a sea "sons and daughters of God". He fully internalized THE WORD, and thus became THE WORD MADE FLESH.

What people like Brent fail to realize is that ALL of the writings are simply people trying to impart the little bit THEY have come to internalize.

We all internalize parts of THE TRUTH. Jesus, supposedly, internalized ALL of it, and tried to show the rest of us how to do the same.

Agnosticus_Caesar
06-03-2007, 10:53 PM
Jesus saves no one. Despite giving his life trying to save everyone.

Damocles
06-03-2007, 10:56 PM
Which was my point. Your "accept" is more like Jefferson's, but not like the born-againers. Each acceptance is different, so I asked for elaboration.

Agnosticus_Caesar
06-03-2007, 10:57 PM
I've explained it before.

Agnosticus_Caesar
06-03-2007, 10:59 PM
The common parlance of "Born-Again" encompasses those who aren't sacrificing much to return to an intellectual state of infancy.

Damocles
06-03-2007, 11:01 PM
The common parlance of "Born-Again" encompasses those who aren't sacrificing much to return to an intellectual state of infancy.
I have explained that you oversimplify. That for some it would be this way, for others I have met, entirely different. Yet if they are right, we all are going to Hell. I'll see you there.

Agnosticus_Caesar
06-03-2007, 11:07 PM
That is why I specified "Common Parlance".

I don't pretend to know the truth...but I can use reason to determine who is likely to be nothing more than a dumbshit.

Damocles
06-03-2007, 11:10 PM
Just like Jefferson, you will find yourself in the minority. Only less so nowadays than back then, yet still in the minority of the belief system. He also insisted that he was "more Christian" than those who believed they were. Even though he wrote his own version of the New Testament that actually removed all mention of Jesus as a Deity.

Agnosticus_Caesar
06-03-2007, 11:14 PM
That was easy for him to do. He simply removed everything that wasn't attributed directly to Jesus.

Agnosticus_Caesar
06-03-2007, 11:16 PM
I have to admit that falling out of love with Jefferson was one of the most constructive periods of my life. I love many f his ideas, but a lot of what he did repulses me.

Agnosticus_Caesar
06-03-2007, 11:17 PM
When it comes to Christianity, Jefferson knew what to do. Some things are easy.

Agnosticus_Caesar
06-03-2007, 11:18 PM
Actually living the life? Not easy.

Agnosticus_Caesar
06-03-2007, 11:21 PM
Some misuse the idea that "All sin, and fall short of the glory of God", as an excuse for doing wrong. I see so-called Christians use it as if it EXCUSED their behavior. It doesn't EXCUSE anything.

It simply shows that one is human, and WILL fail. The point is to TRY to remedy said failure, and GROW towards God. Using it as an EXCUSE will NOT cause one to change their behavior. It will only give one an excuse to continue to do it again and again.

Damocles
06-03-2007, 11:24 PM
Some misuse the idea that "All sin, and fall short of the glory of God", as an excuse for doing wrong. I see so-called Christians use it as if it EXCUSED their behavior. It doesn't EXCUSE anything.

It simply shows that one is human, and WILL fail. The point is to TRY to remedy said failure, and GROW towards God. Using it as an EXCUSE will NOT cause one to change their behavior. It will only give one an excuse to continue to do it again and again.
The very meaning of "repent" is to take a 180 and not do it again. Many assume that it just means that you say "I'm sorry". There would be no reason to have another word if it solely meant to apologize.

Agnosticus_Caesar
06-03-2007, 11:35 PM
Most churches don't preach the philosophy of Christianity. They preach the modern equivalent of what Jesus fought against...Mindless Law-Mongering.

I guess they feel it is okay to dumb it down, as long as the pews (and the collection plates) are full.

Agnosticus_Caesar
06-03-2007, 11:43 PM
Brent was just the sort of self centered imbecile that such churches cater to. they teach these folks that they are superior due to what they "know", and that those who do not agree are evil.

Some wake up, and some don't. Brent is smart enough to know that his arguments have been bullshit. he now seeks to make a mockery of his former self, so as to pass it all off as one big joke.

He's too cowardly to admit that he's changed his mind.

It wouldn't surprise me if he soon "became" a "Strong Atheist". People such as him are prone to grasping from one ridiculous attempt to explain reality to another, without once having the honesty to accept what honestly seems to be.

uscitizen
06-04-2007, 08:47 AM
How long ago was it that Brent was going to be a Moremoan ?

I wonder if that bible school believes in the hollow earth crap ?

Cancel5
06-06-2007, 04:21 PM
Most churches don't preach the philosophy of Christianity. They preach the modern equivalent of what Jesus fought against...Mindless Law-Mongering.

I guess they feel it is okay to dumb it down, as long as the pews (and the collection plates) are full.


Hasn't that been America's motto for the last thirty years?

Agnosticus_Caesar
07-05-2007, 12:55 AM
Far too much of America, unfortunately.

Battleborne
07-07-2007, 09:52 AM
No one is evil. Evil is an emotional tag people put on other people whenever they refuse to understand them and wall them up with indifference.


Well I would say it is fair to assume that the likes of Jeffrey Dohmer and Charlie Manson as well as all other serial killers could be considered "Evil"
What say you???

AnyOldIron II
07-18-2007, 07:55 AM
Well I would say it is fair to assume that the likes of Jeffrey Dohmer and Charlie Manson as well as all other serial killers could be considered "Evil"
What say you???

No. Evil is a description of an act. The act of murder is, IMO, evil, but to state that an individual is evil doesn't really fit. They are people who commit evil acts..

Battleborne
07-18-2007, 11:01 AM
Well I would say it is fair to assume that the likes of Jeffrey Dohmer and Charlie Manson as well as all other serial killers could be considered "Evil"
What say you???

No. Evil is a description of an act. The act of murder is, IMO, evil, but to state that an individual is evil doesn't really fit. They are people who commit evil acts..



evil: www.wordreference.com/definition/evil

FUCK THE POLICE
08-01-2007, 06:02 AM
evil: www.wordreference.com/definition/evil

OMGZ he's proven so much! What a great argument there!

FUCK THE POLICE
08-01-2007, 06:02 AM
Well I would say it is fair to assume that the likes of Jeffrey Dohmer and Charlie Manson as well as all other serial killers could be considered "Evil"
What say you???

Naw. It's because of apathy. I think pretty much everything we call evil can be ascribed to apathy.

FUCK THE POLICE
08-01-2007, 06:05 AM
Some misuse the idea that "All sin, and fall short of the glory of God", as an excuse for doing wrong. I see so-called Christians use it as if it EXCUSED their behavior. It doesn't EXCUSE anything.

It simply shows that one is human, and WILL fail. The point is to TRY to remedy said failure, and GROW towards God. Using it as an EXCUSE will NOT cause one to change their behavior. It will only give one an excuse to continue to do it again and again.

LOL, I've heard that so many times it makes me want to puke. It's really one of the biggest problems with the "saved by faith" philosophy - someone gets "saved" then feels this gives them a right to do whatever they want for the rest of their life.

Hermes Thoth
08-01-2007, 04:40 PM
LOL, I've heard that so many times it makes me want to puke. It's really one of the biggest problems with the "saved by faith" philosophy - someone gets "saved" then feels this gives them a right to do whatever they want for the rest of their life.

You prefer old testament legalism? Figures, noahide who don't know it.

uscitizen
08-02-2007, 11:07 AM
AHZ is a Paulist.

Hermes Thoth
08-03-2007, 05:08 AM
AHZ is a Paulist.

No. I just recognize that dispensationalism is a theological perversion designed to lead christians into noahidism, a trojan horse of neurolinguistic pestilence designed to inculcate a subservient mentality.

uscitizen
08-03-2007, 09:13 AM
Christianity exists because of a subserviant mentality.

Hermes Thoth
08-03-2007, 11:37 AM
Christianity exists because of a subserviant mentality.


Actually, jesus was a rebel.

The Church in cahoots with the Brother In the Craft made him seem stodgy and comformist. He hung with prostitutes.

The Rebel Jesus (4:21) albums ยท lyrics


Original recording from the chieftains album the bells of dublin

All the streets are filled with laughter and light
And the music of the season
And the merchants windows are all bright
With the faces of the children
And the families hurrying to their homes
As the sky darkens and freezes
Theyll be gathering around the hearths and tales
Giving thanks for all gods graces
And the birth of the rebel jesus

Well they call him by the prince of peace
And they call him by the savior
And they pray to him upon the seas
And in every bold endeavor
As they fill his churches with their pride and gold
And their faith in him increases
But theyve turned the nature that I worshipped in
From a temple to a robbers den
In the words of the rebel jesus

We guard our world with locks and guns
And we guard our fine possessions
And once a year when christmas comes
We give to our relations
And perhaps we give a little to the poor
If the generosity should seize us
But if any one of us should interfere
In the business of why they are poor
They get the same as the rebel jesus

But please forgive me if I seem
To take the tone of judgement
For Ive no wish to come between
This day and your enjoyment
In this life of hardship and of earthly toil
We have need for anything that frees us
So I bid you pleasure
And I bid you cheer
From a heathen and a pagan
On the side of the rebel jesus.

Damocles
08-03-2007, 11:41 AM
The Brothers in the Craft? First you are upset because they don't teach Christianity and accept all people who have a faith in God, then you say they teach Christianity? What is wrong with you?

uscitizen
08-03-2007, 12:52 PM
Actually, jesus was a rebel.
//
yes he was a radical liberal.
but that does not diminish my point that Christianity 's existance depends on subserviant people.

besides I do not think he would have like how the religion in his name has turned out.

Hermes Thoth
08-03-2007, 05:07 PM
Actually, jesus was a rebel.
//
yes he was a radical liberal.
but that does not diminish my point that Christianity 's existance depends on subserviant people.

besides I do not think he would have like how the religion in his name has turned out.


If you believe that christianity is only the church with it's self sure pastors I agree. If you consider that my belief in my interpretation of the message of christ, an elitism free, people first approach to living, then I disagree that that requires a subservient mind.

uscitizen
08-03-2007, 06:15 PM
If you believe that christianity is only the church with it's self sure pastors I agree. If you consider that my belief in my interpretation of the message of christ, an elitism free, people first approach to living, then I disagree that that requires a subservient mind.

Worship the Lord, lamb of god, the lord is my sheperd, etc ? Right or wrong Christians are subserviant. You are not a Christian unless you are.

Hermes Thoth
08-03-2007, 06:46 PM
Worship the Lord, lamb of god, the lord is my sheperd, etc ? Right or wrong Christians are subserviant. You are not a Christian unless you are.

Wrong. Stop being such an idiotic fucktool.

uscitizen
08-03-2007, 06:50 PM
My point on christians being subserviant is not negotiable and technically correct.

Damocles
08-03-2007, 07:12 PM
Wrong. Stop being such an idiotic fucktool.
The meek shall inherit the earth, turn the other cheek, love your enemy, the first shall be last and the last shall be first... Live by the sword, die by the sword.

Shall we continue?

uscitizen
08-03-2007, 07:27 PM
Christians are subserviant AHZ, that is a FACT!

OrnotBitwise
08-03-2007, 09:51 PM
Christians are subserviant AHZ, that is a FACT!
Christianity preaches that subservience and reflexive obedience to authority are virtues. That's part of what's wrong with Christianity.

Damocles
08-03-2007, 09:57 PM
Christianity preaches that subservience and reflexive obedience to authority are virtues. That's part of what's wrong with Christianity.
You would be hard-pressed to find, "follow authority" in the bible. You are far more likely to find that you are to be generous with yourself, sometimes at the expense of yourself. Jesus bucked the trend against the standard authority of his church at the same time remaining humble and generally subservient to mankind.

He didn't pay his taxes until he was asked to, if you notice, this doesn't suggest a slavish devotion to authority.

I would say it teaches more of a meekness than a slavish devotion to authority. Now churches themselves may teach that, but it isn't very biblical.

Beefy
08-03-2007, 09:58 PM
The meek shall inherit the earth, turn the other cheek, love your enemy, the first shall be last and the last shall be first... Live by the sword, die by the sword.

Shall we continue?

Love your enemy. What does that mean? It means, obviously, have no enemies.

Turn the other cheek. It means do not unnecessarily get angry and egotistical in things that don't warrant it. It only brings destruction.

The first and last business, I don't know what that means.

Live and die by the sword. This goes back to the other cheek thing. If you want to get all fat headed and obsessed with minor shit, and bust out your sword in defense of your false self, then expect that same sword to kill you, spiritually, and physically, like what happened to my tooth.

OrnotBitwise
08-04-2007, 01:41 AM
You would be hard-pressed to find, "follow authority" in the bible. You are far more likely to find that you are to be generous with yourself, sometimes at the expense of yourself. Jesus bucked the trend against the standard authority of his church at the same time remaining humble and generally subservient to mankind.

He didn't pay his taxes until he was asked to, if you notice, this doesn't suggest a slavish devotion to authority.

I would say it teaches more of a meekness than a slavish devotion to authority. Now churches themselves may teach that, but it isn't very biblical.
I am not talking about the teachings of some weirdo Rabbinical radical a couple of millennia ago. I'm talking about the teachings and beliefs of Christians today. I judge them by what they do, not what they claim to believe.

Hermes Thoth
08-04-2007, 05:06 AM
Christianity preaches that subservience and reflexive obedience to authority are virtues. That's part of what's wrong with Christianity.


That's the influence of the man-created church not the lesson of the biblical narrative. This submission to the priesthood concept is an ingrafting into the faith from the surrounding sacerdotal systems of the region. Jesus was against this kind of hierarchy actually. He was not a RABBI. They wanted him killed for his backtalk.

Hermes Thoth
08-04-2007, 05:12 AM
Many of you are confusing morality with subservience, that is a common mistake in a society so constructed upon abuse.

Hermes Thoth
08-04-2007, 05:20 AM
The meek shall inherit the earth, turn the other cheek, love your enemy, the first shall be last and the last shall be first... Live by the sword, die by the sword.

Shall we continue?

Turn the other cheek: after two cheeks, it's go time,


Love your enemy: You can love your enemy, it doesn't mean you cant kick his ass in self defense. Ever had a brother?

OrnotBitwise
08-05-2007, 11:49 AM
That's the influence of the man-created church not the lesson of the biblical narrative. This submission to the priesthood concept is an ingrafting into the faith from the surrounding sacerdotal systems of the region. Jesus was against this kind of hierarchy actually. He was not a RABBI. They wanted him killed for his backtalk.
That's your personal opinion. Who cares? The only FACTS actually available arise from how people in general interpret/react to the doctrine. The only reasonable question is: how effective is Christianity in general at fostering independent, creative thought? Unfortunately, it doesn't look good for the Jews for Jesus (Christians) in that context.

Ironically, Protestants are even worse than Catholics and Orthodox when it comes to using their brains for anything other than keeping their hair out of their eyes.

Hermes Thoth
08-05-2007, 02:07 PM
That's your personal opinion. Who cares? The only FACTS actually available arise from how people in general interpret/react to the doctrine. The only reasonable question is: how effective is Christianity in general at fostering independent, creative thought? Unfortunately, it doesn't look good for the Jews for Jesus (Christians) in that context.

Ironically, Protestants are even worse than Catholics and Orthodox when it comes to using their brains for anything other than keeping their hair out of their eyes.


You wouldn't know an independant thought if it came and sucked your titty. You're a collection of hackneyed, nihilsitic, anti-human, self congratulating, murderous sick fuck, elitist mongering, self important, self justifying, critical thought allergic, globalist worshipping pseudomemes.

uscitizen
08-05-2007, 06:00 PM
I am not talking about the teachings of some weirdo Rabbinical radical a couple of millennia ago. I'm talking about the teachings and beliefs of Christians today. I judge them by what they do, not what they claim to believe.

I am also talking about the Christianity of today. And subserviance to Jesus/God is the basis for Salvation in virtually all if not all Christian denominations.
and if AHZ does not believe this he is not a Christian. that is not to say he does not believe in God. Just that he is not a member of the Christian Religion and most all of them will say he is going to hell for not being subserviant.

I believe in none of the above, God, Hell, etc...
But have been well trained in it.

Hermes Thoth
08-07-2007, 05:22 AM
I am also talking about the Christianity of today. And subserviance to Jesus/God is the basis for Salvation in virtually all if not all Christian denominations.
and if AHZ does not believe this he is not a Christian. that is not to say he does not believe in God. Just that he is not a member of the Christian Religion and most all of them will say he is going to hell for not being subserviant.

I believe in none of the above, God, Hell, etc...
But have been well trained in it.


Victims of abuse oftentimes can only interpret relationships in a submission/domination context. Love is foreign to them. It's sad. "Abuser" and "abused" become the two archetypes in their sad little world.

Jesus is not to be submitted to, neither is god, they are to be loved. Your brutalized psyche has fogotton love.

This is you.



http://www.fhu.com/articles/evil.html
Many people not only will never awaken to acknowledge and repent of their own corrupt state, but they choose to remain zealously preoccupied with keeping others confused and asleep. Such as these go about the dirty business of degrading, even killing millions struggling for meaning and happiness. After all, the only way such as these can maintain the illusion of a misguided sense of worth is by destroying the consciousness of those around them. Left alone to unfold, the bright, unaltered consciousness in others would take back their world and prick the conscience of the earth bound, into recognition of their deformed selves, and they cannot allow that to happen.

Agnosticus_Caesar
11-10-2007, 11:02 AM
Apparently, Brent is also too stupid to understand that when Jesus said "This is my blood", and so on, he was speaking SYMBOLICALLY.

The point he was making was that his followers should REMEMBER him when they gathered for a meal, as, at that time, the meal was the time of family unity.

Said1
11-10-2007, 01:14 PM
I am not talking about the teachings of some weirdo Rabbinical radical a couple of millennia ago. I'm talking about the teachings and beliefs of Christians today. I judge them by what they do, not what they claim to believe.


I haven't been to church in a LONG time, so I'm really not up on the teachings and beliefs of today. Could you elaborate re: subserviance to authority? I don't recall that, but like I said, it's been awhile.

Cancel7
11-11-2007, 06:26 AM
You wouldn't know an independant thought if it came and sucked your titty. You're a collection of hackneyed, nihilsitic, anti-human, self congratulating, murderous sick fuck, elitist mongering, self important, self justifying, critical thought allergic, globalist worshipping pseudomemes.


Hmmm...maybe it's not safe to meet Ornot for lunch.

hhahahahahhaha

Oh asshat, you are really too much.

Hermes Thoth
11-11-2007, 06:28 AM
Hmmm...maybe it's not safe to meet Ornot for lunch.

hhahahahahhaha

Oh asshat, you are really too much.

Well, you know I secretly want you.

Battleborne
11-11-2007, 03:55 PM
Well, you know I secretly want you.


Azzhats fantasy encounter with Darla...In his wet dreams mind ya!

www.freakyhumor.com/pics.shtml?0149.jpg