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ib1yysguy
08-16-2009, 02:03 AM
What if I were to tell you there was a man who existed today who has been witnessed doing many miracles by countless people. This guy's no loonie fringe dude. When his followers threw him a birthday party last year, 1 million people showed up. You can even watch his miracles on YouTube. He even claims to have been born of a virgin.

What would be your reaction if I told you this?

His name is Sathya Sai Baba. If you plan to watch his miracles on YouTube, prepare to be disappointed. Yet, millions of people follow this guy as though he's a deity.

My point here is that this guy who has miracles of underwhelming proportions recorded on the internet is followed by millions as though he's a god, yet his accomplishments don't even merit an hour on the Discovery channel.

However, put a few uncorroborated miracles of a man in an ancient book of tales from the Bronze Age, and people find it a rational exercise to organize their lives around him.

Something is wrong with this picture.

Cancel 2018. 3
08-16-2009, 10:27 AM
the bible predicted this would happen

Damocles
08-16-2009, 02:27 PM
You should have linked up to a few underwhelming miracles.

Minister of Truth
08-16-2009, 09:26 PM
You should have linked up to a few underwhelming miracles.

No need, the post was underwhelming enough.

FUCK THE POLICE
08-17-2009, 12:34 AM
Jesus fails.

Cancel 2018. 3
08-17-2009, 05:45 PM
Jesus fails.

odd....given he predicted this would happen

ib1yysguy
08-17-2009, 06:33 PM
odd....given he predicted this would happen

As long as you're the first guy to go on record declaring there will be false prophets, it means you're the one true prophet. Gotcha.

The fact is you have no more reason to believe Jesus did any miracles in his time than you do to believe this guy is performing them presently, considering Jesus' miracles were recorded by the most superstitious, most backward, most illiterate people in the world and you can at least watch this guy's "miracles" on youtube.

maineman
08-17-2009, 06:38 PM
the bible predicted this would happen

bingo...well said

DamnYankee
08-17-2009, 06:45 PM
What if I were to tell you there was a man who existed today who has been witnessed doing many miracles by countless people. This guy's no loonie fringe dude. When his followers threw him a birthday party last year, 1 million people showed up. You can even watch his miracles on YouTube. He even claims to have been born of a virgin.

What would be your reaction if I told you this?

His name is Sathya Sai Baba. If you plan to watch his miracles on YouTube, prepare to be disappointed. Yet, millions of people follow this guy as though he's a deity.

My point here is that this guy who has miracles of underwhelming proportions recorded on the internet is followed by millions as though he's a god, yet his accomplishments don't even merit an hour on the Discovery channel.

However, put a few uncorroborated miracles of a man in an ancient book of tales from the Bronze Age, and people find it a rational exercise to organize their lives around him.

Something is wrong with this picture.

When people still throw birthday party's for Sathya Sai Baba in 2000 years then you can make a valid comparison with Jesus. Otherwise he's not much different than Michael Jackson, just with a different gig. *shrug*

ib1yysguy
08-17-2009, 06:53 PM
When people still throw birthday party's for Sathya Sai Baba in 2000 years then you can make a valid comparison with Jesus. Otherwise he's not much different than Michael Jackson, just with a different gig. *shrug*

uh huh

I guarantee you Mormonism is around to stay, and we all know how much bullshit that is based on. Scientology is likely to be around a while too, and that's a religion about magical aliens in a volcano.

Damocles
08-17-2009, 06:57 PM
LOL. He's the goose that barfs golden eggs!

Damocles
08-17-2009, 07:06 PM
He's a poor magician.

YouTube - Sai Baba Exposed - Part 1 of 4

DamnYankee
08-17-2009, 07:11 PM
uh huh

I guarantee you Mormonism is around to stay, and we all know how much bullshit that is based on. Scientology is likely to be around a while too, and that's a religion about magical aliens in a volcano.
Mormonism is a sect of Christianity; again a 2000 year religion. Scientology been around for a relative blink. *shrug*

PostmodernProphet
08-17-2009, 08:08 PM
uh huh

I guarantee you Mormonism is around to stay, and we all know how much bullshit that is based on. Scientology is likely to be around a while too, and that's a religion about magical aliens in a volcano.

Mormonism today bears little resemblance to Joseph Smith's version....if you attended a Mormon service you see little difference from a typical Episcopalian service....

uscitizen
08-17-2009, 11:23 PM
Unless you go to a fundamentalist Moremoan church.
Of course I am not sure they will let just anyone in.

ib1yysguy
08-18-2009, 01:28 AM
Mormonism today bears little resemblance to Joseph Smith's version....if you attended a Mormon service you see little difference from a typical Episcopalian service....

You're trying to make it sound as though there's some sort of clear parity between Mormonism and Christianity. That's hugely wrong. They are very clearly doctrinally delineated, regardless of what they don't show you to your face when you show up for a service (after all, their big mission in life is to get more members and you can't do that if you freak out newcomers with your craziness - they save that for later).

FUCK THE POLICE
08-18-2009, 01:58 AM
Mormonism is a sect of Christianity; again a 2000 year religion. Scientology been around for a relative blink. *shrug*

Mormonism has been around since the 1850's. Scientology since around the 60's. And scientologists actually accept Christian members; like most new-age religions, they don't discriminate based on what diety the believer is a believer in (which is great for integration into the society).

I don't really think you could consider Mormonism a sect of Christianity any more than you could Islam. They very clearly add to the doctrine in a way that Christian would not approve. If you give them 1500 years they'll be completely different, just like the Muslims.

PostmodernProphet
08-18-2009, 04:36 AM
Unless you go to a fundamentalist Moremoan church.
Of course I am not sure they will let just anyone in.

true, but then if you go to an extremely fundamentalist Christian church it doesn't look much like the rest of the religion either....or an extremely fundamentalist Muslim church and Islam......

PostmodernProphet
08-18-2009, 04:42 AM
You're trying to make it sound as though there's some sort of clear parity between Mormonism and Christianity. That's hugely wrong. They are very clearly doctrinally delineated, regardless of what they don't show you to your face when you show up for a service (after all, their big mission in life is to get more members and you can't do that if you freak out newcomers with your craziness - they save that for later).

my point is that the Mormons have softened those doctrines considerably more than just painting black over the windows to the inner sanctum....the same is true of most Christian denominations....a hundred years ago my Calvinist denomination split from another because the Synod allowed the Presbyterians to take communion with us....today, all three take communion with everyone from Catholics to Southern Baptists.....

DamnYankee
08-18-2009, 06:14 AM
Mormonism has been around since the 1850's. Scientology since around the 60's. And scientologists actually accept Christian members; like most new-age religions, they don't discriminate based on what diety the believer is a believer in (which is great for integration into the society).

I don't really think you could consider Mormonism a sect of Christianity any more than you could Islam. They very clearly add to the doctrine in a way that Christian would not approve. If you give them 1500 years they'll be completely different, just like the Muslims. Dood, Mormonism is The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Catholics have saints too. Do you know what a saint is?

FUCK THE POLICE
08-18-2009, 12:41 PM
Dood, Mormonism is The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Catholics have saints too. Do you know what a saint is?

Yes. They are clearly a branch off from Christianity, but I think they are different enough that you could call them a different religion, just like Christianity is a branch from Judaism.

ib1yysguy
08-18-2009, 01:57 PM
He's a poor magician.

YouTube - Sai Baba Exposed - Part 1 of 4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwOecpMkHH0)

WHAT? You mean he's not really performing miracles???

Of course it's all a trick, Damo. The point is that even poor magicians when they perform their art in backwards, illiterate parts of the world can find people (in this case millions, and in Jesus' case quite a few less than millions during his life) who will believe they're genuine and that the magician is in fact some kind of god.

Cancel 2018. 3
08-18-2009, 03:00 PM
WHAT? You mean he's not really performing miracles???

Of course it's all a trick, Damo. The point is that even poor magicians when they perform their art in backwards, illiterate parts of the world can find people (in this case millions, and in Jesus' case quite a few less than millions during his life) who will believe they're genuine and that the magician is in fact some kind of god.

dude....give it up....you weren't there when jesus performed miracles so all you have is belief he didn't....don't try and act like your beliefs are facts

and i notice you and waterbong keep ignoring that this was predicted

DamnYankee
08-18-2009, 03:15 PM
Yes. They are clearly a branch off from Christianity, but I think they are different enough that you could call them a different religion, just like Christianity is a branch from Judaism. Are you suggesting that a religion that celebrates Christ and has Christ in its name isn't Christian? LOL

PostmodernProphet
08-18-2009, 03:33 PM
Are you suggesting that a religion that celebrates Christ and has Christ in its name isn't Christian? LOL

I can live with that.....when Mormonism was founded, it's beliefs WEREN'T Christian....they denied the divinity of Jesus, which I would consider a prerequisite for a "Christian" religion.....without that it would only be legitimate to call themselves "Jesus-onian"......today, their official doctrines acknowledge his divinity.....

FUCK THE POLICE
08-18-2009, 04:21 PM
I can live with that.....when Mormonism was founded, it's beliefs WEREN'T Christian....they denied the divinity of Jesus, which I would consider a prerequisite for a "Christian" religion.....without that it would only be legitimate to call themselves "Jesus-onian"......today, their official doctrines acknowledge his divinity.....

The divinity of Jesus was something Christians, again, pulled out of their asses in the 4th century.

Are you literally going to say that the Jehova's Witnesses and other primitivists are not Christians, but Mormons are?

PostmodernProphet
08-18-2009, 05:52 PM
The divinity of Jesus was something Christians, again, pulled out of their asses in the 4th century.

hardly, Jesus himself said that he was God....


Are you literally going to say that the Jehova's Witnesses and other primitivists are not Christians, but Mormons are?
???...I have said nothing at all about Jehovah's Witnesses...at the moment I don't recall what their doctrine is regarding divinity, and I'm too lazy to look it up merely to appease your curiosity.....

FUCK THE POLICE
08-18-2009, 06:23 PM
???...I have said nothing at all about Jehovah's Witnesses...at the moment I don't recall what their doctrine is regarding divinity, and I'm too lazy to look it up merely to appease your curiosity.....

The Jehovah's witnesses hold a unitarian instead of trinitarian view of god.

I'm not sure there are non-primitivist churches that are unitarian and not post-Christian (Unitarian Universalists started off as Christian but have abandoned all creed, and so they're usually called a post-Christian religion). Our second president was a Unitarian, though.

PostmodernProphet
08-18-2009, 06:29 PM
then by my definition I would not give them the name Christian....."Christ" denotes the concept of 'savior'....by definition a non-divine Jesus could not be "Christ", therefore it would not be appropriate to call oneself a "Christ"ian....such could be followers of Jesus, but would not be followers of Christ.....