Don't Piss Off Israel!

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Boys and Girls, Israel is giving us a lesson in how to fight a war in the middle east. They are demonstrating how we should be waging the war on Islamofascism, with the intensity and fervor of people on a mission.

This enemy does not understand diplomacy. It is a sign of weakness. The calls for cease-fire are laughable. Simply translated, they mean, "please hold up and let us re-organize, so we can try to kill you again."

This is the time the world should step to the plate and stop the Islamofascists, but just as it was in WWII, the Doves will make everyone wait. Unbelievably, some people still think we could have sat down at a table with OBL before 9/11, and made all our problems vanish. They foolishly believe, if we just fed their poor and helped them, they would like us and everything would be great again.

This problem can be traced back to Biblical times, but the current manifestation came about during the Carter Administration, when the Doves allowed the Shea to fall, and the Ayatollahs began their religious reign in Iran. Fanatics began to conjure up new meaning to Islamic belief, and it has perpetuated and spread across the middle east for the past quarter-century. This is a modern-day Nazism, and we are in the early days of WWIII.

[Beefy]

I agree. Good for Israel, they are strong, the can stand on their own two feet. Lets let them be, lets let them fight their own wars, and from now on, lets let them make their own weapons and fund it from their own economy.

Israel is strong, they have fortitude, lets let them fight their own wars, with their own money, with their own weapons, and with their own fortitude. Its their war, lets stay out of it.

[Damocles]

Things Jesus Didn't Say:

1. It's all good! Just kill them all I'll sort them out!

[FUCK THE POLICE]

Boys and Girls, Israel is giving us a lesson in how to fight a war in the middle east. They are demonstrating how we should be waging the war on Islamofascism, with the intensity and fervor of people on a mission.

This enemy does not understand diplomacy. It is a sign of weakness. The calls for cease-fire are laughable. Simply translated, they mean, "please hold up and let us re-organize, so we can try to kill you again."

This is the time the world should step to the plate and stop the Islamofascists, but just as it was in WWII, the Doves will make everyone wait. Unbelievably, some people still think we could have sat down at a table with OBL before 9/11, and made all our problems vanish. They foolishly believe, if we just fed their poor and helped them, they would like us and everything would be great again.

This problem can be traced back to Biblical times, but the current manifestation came about during the Carter Administration, when the Doves allowed the Shea to fall, and the Ayatollahs began their religious reign in Iran. Fanatics began to conjure up new meaning to Islamic belief, and it has perpetuated and spread across the middle east for the past quarter-century. This is a modern-day Nazism, and we are in the early days of WWIII.

You're a fucking moron.

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Are you two failing to understand who we are at war with? They don't intend to stop fighting it, regardless of how much you try to pretend we are Jesus, and believe the damned Jews can take care of themselves. You do understand, they seek to destroy anyone who doesn't subscribe to their 5th Century Muhammad law? ...and that means US!

I don't like war, and I understand this is a religious war, and that we will never change the fanatical Muslim religious beliefs, they will forever be a problem because they are ingrained into a gigantic segment of people through religious faith. The message that should be made clear, is we will no longer believe in diplomacy when you start blowing our shit up and killing innocent people. As civilized society, we have an obligation to demand the barbaric and fascist tactics of terrorism in the name of religious dogma, be stopped.

I don't know if it's what Jesus would do, but I am not Jesus!

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

You're a fucking moron.

Wow Waterhead, that was a great counter-point!
You must have studied at the ib1 School of Pinhead Retort.

[Beefy]

You're a fucking moron.

Wow Waterhead, that was a great counter-point!
You must have studied at the ib1 School of Pinhead Retort.

Choosing to couter his point is equally as telling.

[Beefy]

Are you two failing to understand who we are at war with? They don't intend to stop fighting it, regardless of how much you try to pretend we are Jesus, and believe the damned Jews can take care of themselves. You do understand, they seek to destroy anyone who doesn't subscribe to their 5th Century Muhammad law? ...and that means US!

I don't like war, and I understand this is a religious war, and that we will never change the fanatical Muslim religious beliefs, they will forever be a problem because they are ingrained into a gigantic segment of people through religious faith. The message that should be made clear, is we will no longer believe in diplomacy when you start blowing our shit up and killing innocent people. As civilized society, we have an obligation to demand the barbaric and fascist tactics of terrorism in the name of religious dogma, be stopped.

I don't know if it's what Jesus would do, but I am not Jesus!

Let me just understand you here. They arbitrarily hate Israel and us, the just want to kill jews and Americans. There is nothing else, not one iota of anything else to this nightmare. They're bad, they hate Jews and Americans, and that's all we need to know right?

[FUCK THE POLICE]

Yes, MBL, they sit in their evil lairs all day and laugh maniacally with their plans to rule the world and cover it in EVILE. Isn't that obvious? Human beings aren't complicated! They're just automations that magically fit into Dixie's distorted black and white view of life.

[klaatu]

Jamaat-i-Islami - founder, Maulana Maududi, wrote:
"The objective of Islamic 'jihad' is to eliminate the rule of an un-Islamic system and establish in its stead an Islamic system of state rule. Islam does not intend to confine this revolution to a single state or a few countries; the aim of Islam is to bring about a universal revolution.'"


The goal is not confined to the US and Israel ....

What is Jihad?

From Wikipedia:

Jihad, sometimes spelled Jahad, Jehad Jihaad or Djehad, (Arabic: جهاد‎ ǧihād) is an Islamic term, from the Arabic root ǧhd ("to exert utmost effort, to strive, struggle"), which connotes a wide range of meanings: anything from an inward spiritual struggle to attain perfect faith to a political or military struggle to further the Islamic cause. Individuals involved in the political or military forms of jihad are often labeled with the neologism "jihadist".


This does not translate to wiping out Islam.. we still need to defend ourselves but we also need to negotiate. There was a time when Christians went on a Crusade as well .. albeit between the 11th and 13th Centuries ...
The message that needs to go out to the Islamic People is the goal of Peace.. the World must help them overcome their facist leadership and demand it.

[maineman]

Let me just understand you here. They arbitrarily hate Israel and us, the just want to kill jews and Americans. There is nothing else, not one iota of anything else to this nightmare. They're bad, they hate Jews and Americans, and that's all we need to know right?

well said, beefy.... well said.

the world is a complicated place...and the variety and complexity of human emotion and motivation cannot be successfully addressed by people who live in a black and white world.

[maineman]

to allow them to continue to direct the foreign policy of america is criminal.

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Let me just understand you here. They arbitrarily hate Israel and us, the just want to kill jews and Americans. There is nothing else, not one iota of anything else to this nightmare. They're bad, they hate Jews and Americans, and that's all we need to know right?

Nothing arbitrary about it. They don't just want to kills Jews and Americans, it's anyone who doesn't want to capitulate to their warped view of Islam. I encourage you to "know" everything you can about these people, go read what they have to say in their Fatwah's, don't just accept the propaganda from those who wish to use your stupidity against you. They will most certainly allow us to believe we can negotiate with them, or that we can do something to reach a diplomatic solution. That is merely a strategy, and one they've continually used in the past.

[Care4all]

Boys and Girls, Israel is giving us a lesson in how to fight a war in the middle east. They are demonstrating how we should be waging the war on Islamofascism, with the intensity and fervor of people on a mission.

This enemy does not understand diplomacy. It is a sign of weakness. The calls for cease-fire are laughable. Simply translated, they mean, "please hold up and let us re-organize, so we can try to kill you again."

This is the time the world should step to the plate and stop the Islamofascists, but just as it was in WWII, the Doves will make everyone wait. Unbelievably, some people still think we could have sat down at a table with OBL before 9/11, and made all our problems vanish. They foolishly believe, if we just fed their poor and helped them, they would like us and everything would be great again.

This problem can be traced back to Biblical times, but the current manifestation came about during the Carter Administration, when the Doves allowed the Shea to fall, and the Ayatollahs began their religious reign in Iran. Fanatics began to conjure up new meaning to Islamic belief, and it has perpetuated and spread across the middle east for the past quarter-century. This is a modern-day Nazism, and we are in the early days of WWIII.

I agree and disagree with you Dixie. First, let's say when it REALLY began....it started when the western world tried to colonize the middle east and make deals with tribes that never came through....and when we became involved in staking our claim to their oil for our needs.....imo.

We dealt with these people of Islam that could supply us our oil and manipulated the region, creating countries that never were and taking away countries that had been there forever...putting and taking people from power....

You must be able to recognize this...not because you have to be a DOVE, but because MISTAKES WEE MADE BY US, and we must learn from them.

We supported these Royal Families that we let rise to power, solely for our own purposes, and turned a BLIND EYE to the atrocities that were occurring to the everyday people that lived there.....this is what caused the hatred towards the western world....Israel, wasn't even created yet and we were harming the muslims and arabs that were living there in poverty and dying in poverty, while the royal families sucked in the dough we gave them so READILY....

now you can try to rewrite history, and you can try to justify the UNJUST WAR actions that Israel has taken and that we have taken in Iraq, till the cows come home....and your ilke can scream WAR, WAR, WAR.....because they just hate us for no reason at all, just because we are Jews or Americans till the cows come home too, but anyone with any kind of brain knows that this simple minded thinking or yours will do nothing but MAKE FURTHER WARS HAPPEN.....YOU SUPPORT the movement of the Antichrist that the Bible Prophesies about and NOT the words that Jesus Himself gave us of LOVING YOUR ENEMY, treating him as you would want to be treated.

I think that Israel had a right to attack back and with a fury, for the deaths and the kidnapping of the two soldiers.

But I do NOT think they had the right to continue with this bombing and continue to kill HUNDREDS OF INNOCENT PEOPLE that had NOTHING to do with the attacks on israel other than live in Lebanon....

That would be like me saying that IT WAS OKAY FOR THE TWIN TOWERS TO BE ATTACKED AND THE INNOCENT THERE TO BE KILLED, BECAUSE OF WHAT OUR GOVERNMENT HAD DONE OR ALLOWED......wouldn't it?

IS THAT WHAT YOU are saying Dixie?

care

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Care, I am not saying the US hasn't made mistakes in the region, as well as other European countries, and all nations, for that matter. These mistakes merely act as a catalyst, an excuse, a justification for the Jihadists. Their motives and intent, have nothing to do with our past mistakes and everything to do with the perversion of Islam.

Simply put, they believe they are doing God's work by eliminating the Jews and Infidels. They believe this is not only mandated in the Qaran, but a necessary requirement for the return of Allah. They believe their deaths are martyrdom for this cause, and they will be rewarded in heaven for killing Jews and Infidels. There is no negotiating with this view, and there is absolutely nothing we can do to appease them.

Yes, we've made mistakes, but if we allow ourselves to start questioning the past and second guessing what is happening in the present, they will prevail in this battle. The spread of Islamofascism is not going to stop until we stand up and stop it. It's not our fault, and we are not to blame, for the perversion of Islam into this fanatical fascist barbarism we know today.

[maineman]

Dixie's belief that the past actions of Europe and the west have "nothing to do" with motivating Islamic extremism is frightening in its inaccuracy. The thought that simpletons like him are anywhere near the seat of decision making for American foreign policy is cause for great alarm.

[toby]

Israel and Omert are just big fakes. If they were serious they would have attacked Syria and bombed Damascus. Instead they are playing a silly game. The ...I am an tough guy and am being held back by my friends, otherwise I would kick your ass...........LOL But Bush is not playing along.........yet.

[toby]

Why the now are stopping a a mile into Lebanon? LOL Hold them back??? Guess we don't need to after all.

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Why the now are stopping a a mile into Lebanon? LOL Hold them back??? Guess we don't need to after all.

They've run out of Hezbollah shit to bomb! Israel has no beef with the Lebanese people, they have no desire to occupy the country. The mission is to disarm, disable, and destroy Hezbollah. I think they have done more in 2 weeks than Diplomacy has done in total, to that regard. Don't you?

[toby]

No Dixie, I think they backed down. Did you not understand my post? They are asking to be held back. They don't want to go into Lebanon now that they found it will not be as easy as they thought it would be.

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

No Dixie, I think they backed down. Did you not understand my post? They are asking to be held back. They don't want to go into Lebanon now that they found it will not be as easy as they thought it would be.

The REAL problem is not Lebanon, or Hezbollah. We both know who the head of the beast is here, let's not get caught up in the diversions. Israel has no intent in becoming involved in a guerilla war with a militia supported by Syria and Iran. They have eliminated much of Hezbollah's capacity, regardless of how it looks at the moment. Iran instigated this, because it's a diversion of resources for Israel, as well as the US and others, which buys them precious time in developing a nuke. A protracted war between Israel and Hezbollah in Lebanon, does not help the overall strategy in play. Sure, it would be optimal to eliminate ALL of Hezbollah, and if they wanted to, they probably have that capability, but this would play into the Iranian's hands, it's exactly what they want.

[toby]

I said if they were serious they would have went after Syria. They did not do so and now they are stopping a mile into Lebanon. Asking to be held back!

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

I said if they were serious they would have went after Syria.

I wouldn't start laughing at the joke just yet.

[AnyOldIron]

How would we guess that Dixie would support the targeting of civilians with the intention of bringing about political change, bombing civilian infrastructure and terrorising a population?

With all his rhetoric concerning terrorism, you'd thing he'd oppose terrorism on both sides.

But wait, it seems that Dixie is terrorism's cheerleader, whooping at the indiscriminate killing of civilians and destruction of civilian infrastructure...

Who'd have thought that that some-one as self-certain as Dixie would be so shortsighted, failing to see how bombing civilians and civilian infrastructure only exasperates the situation and makes finding a peaceful resolution in the next generation completely impossible.

Who'd have thought that Dixie would attribute the troubles in the ME to a corruption in the Muslim religion, and ascribe the history of the ME as merely an excuse, when religion is widely known to be used as the excuse, and history the justification.


Well, I guess anyone who's read Dixie's posts, I suppose.

Our Dixie, thinking as shallow as a paddling pool, blinkered as a racehorse but as certain of himself as a cockerel...

[Damocles]

I said if they were serious they would have went after Syria.

I wouldn't start laughing at the joke just yet.

This was post number 2000... Cool.

[FUCK THE POLICE]

Dixie, if a hornets nest is stirred up, sometimes the best answer isn't to walk right into it and swat all of them away by hand.

Maybe they have reasons that they're pissed? Actually, some of their reasons are very good ones. They just shouldn't have blown themselves up over it. But we shouldn't just sit here and have too much pride to admit what was wrong and kill people whenever there are better solutions.

[Cypress]

Dixie, if a hornets nest is stirred up, sometimes the best answer isn't to walk right into it and swat all of them away by hand.

Maybe they have reasons that they're pissed? Actually, some of their reasons are very good ones. They just shouldn't have blown themselves up over it. But we shouldn't just sit here and have too much pride to admit what was wrong and kill people whenever there are better solutions.

Watermark]Dixie, if a hornets nest is stirred up, sometimes the best answer isn't to walk right into it and swat all of them away by hand.

Good analogy.

Same mistake dixie made with his iraq war: When an idiot knocks the top off a hornets nest, and you're getting swarmed by hornets, the idiot can't scream: "Well, what's the democratic plan!!!???"

[maineman]

Watermark]Dixie, if a hornets nest is stirred up, sometimes the best answer isn't to walk right into it and swat all of them away by hand.

Good analogy.

Same mistake dixie made with his iraq war: When an idiot knocks the top off a hornets nest, and you're getting swarmed by hornets, the idiot can't scream: "Well, what's the democratic plan!!!???"

exactly....they fucked it up and then they complain that we aren't equipped with a plan to clean up THEIR mess.

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Dixie, if a hornets nest is stirred up, sometimes the best answer isn't to walk right into it and swat all of them away by hand.

Maybe they have reasons that they're pissed? Actually, some of their reasons are very good ones. They just shouldn't have blown themselves up over it. But we shouldn't just sit here and have too much pride to admit what was wrong and kill people whenever there are better solutions.

Maybe you can tell us why they're pissed? I already know, but please, entertain me! Explain to me what their main problem is, what they want? I don't have too much pride to admit what they want, do you? If there is a better solution, I would like to hear it... pretend you have the floor in negotiations with radical Islamic Fundamentalists in the War on Terror... what do you say to them? What do you negotiate about?

[FUCK THE POLICE]

I don't want to talk to them. It's impossible to stop them, it's impossible to practically impossible to convince people of things. But all we're doing currently is making more of them by painting a bad image of ourselves. Let's be rational about this - we are powerful. No matter what, the poorer people's of the world are going to look at us and anything that touches us with disdain, and they will believe we are arrogant and treat them mearly as pawns. Well, we're proving them right, and it's merely breeding more hatred.

[Agnosticus_Caesar]

Yeah, wage a war against Islamists by killing innocent civilians. That NEVER results in xreating more Islamists.

FUCKING MORON.

[Care4all]

Yeah, wage a war against Islamists by killing innocent civilians. That NEVER results in xreating more Islamists.

FUCKING MORON.

I agree with you, that these kind of actions just create more terrorists...

What should Israel have done in retalliation for the kidnappings and the build op of Hezbollah adjacent to their border?

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Yeah, wage a war against Islamists by killing innocent civilians. That NEVER results in xreating more Islamists.

FUCKING MORON.

Radical Islamofascists are the reason innocent people are being killed. If they would stop hiding in neighborhoods and launching rockets from behind the skirt of the UN, maybe there wouldn't be any "collateral damage" in this. But they don't give a shit about human life, they will exploit and kill as many civilians as they like, because they are on a mission from God!

YOU PEOPLE ARE THE MORONS!

Agno, an Islamist practices the Muslim religion. A radical Islamic Fundamentalist is a different thing. They are a disease among Islamic people, and they have to be dealt with, just like alQaeda had to be dealt with, and Saddam had to be dealt with, and Armagedonnutbag will have to be dealt with, and Kim Jong... Putin might even have to be dealt with someday.

For right now, we are in a War on Terror, but that is the "Politically Correct" term for this war. It should be called, the War on Islamofascism. These people want to eventually dominate the world. They certainly want to dominate their half of the world right now, and they don't believe in Freedom and Democracy, they believe in following the 1200 A.D. edicts of Mohammed Law. They also believe that those who don't believe as they do, deserve to have their head sawed off. ...and they are sorta stubborn like SR about it!

You fuckwits want to sit around pretending to be modern-day Jesus' singing Kumbaya with them! You honestly think there is some way for us to buy them off or appease them, and you fail to understand, they don't want our money, they don't want our western culture, they despise it and find it revolting, they want us off their planet! They will use your heart-strings against you, and have clearly done so in the past, they laugh about how easy it is! They can play you like a Stradivarius through the whores in the media, they've perfected the system to a tee.

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

I don't want to talk to them. It's impossible to stop them, it's impossible to practically impossible to convince people of things. But all we're doing currently is making more of them by painting a bad image of ourselves. Let's be rational about this - we are powerful. No matter what, the poorer people's of the world are going to look at us and anything that touches us with disdain, and they will believe we are arrogant and treat them mearly as pawns. Well, we're proving them right, and it's merely breeding more hatred.

Excuse me, but exactly WHAT do you want to do? Ignore them? Pretend they don't exist, and don't want us to all die? That's a great plan... go stick your head back in the sand, Waterhead... when you find some balls, we can have a conversation about it.

Sheesh!

[FUCK THE POLICE]

Excuse me, but exactly WHAT do you want to do? Ignore them? Pretend they don't exist, and don't want us to all die? That's a great plan... go stick your head back in the sand, Waterhead... when you find some balls, we can have a conversation about it.

Sheesh!


OK then...

Let's blow them up. Send 30 rockets into a neighborhood. Kill them and 20 other innocent civilians, destroy the neighborhood. Kill a few kids. Maybe the other kids will grow up to be terrorists and will hate America, but who cares? At least we had balls!

[Care4all]

The only way to solve the situation is to figure out what has caused it and to flood them with money to take care of their needy and poor so that hezbollah isn't the one that does this...we need the people on our side and not on Hezbollah's, hamas's, and Alqaeda's, and to get rid of the schools that teach hatred towards the west...

we can kill all the adults you like and the children will still grow up to be terrorists because they are in abject poverty and because of these schools....imo....

[maineman]

in the black and white cartoon world of Dixie and the neocon chickenhawks, the fact that the bad guys hide in neighborhoods is somehow the fault of the innocent women and children living in those neighborhoods.... and when Israel kills them in southern lebanon, or we kill them in Iraq, all it does is make a lot more enemies than it kills... we have been doing that pretty much nonstop for over three years now...

[Agnosticus_Caesar]

Let's take it to REAL-TIME voice chat. I doubt many of you have the balls.

[Beefy]

Let's take it to REAL-TIME voice chat. I doubt many of you have the balls.

I think it has less to do with balls, and more to do with posting at our leisure. Who the hell wants to listen to some whiner all day?


Worst. Suggention. Ever.

[IHateGovernment]

Hey AC I noticed your post on the other site. wouldn't mind debating you but I fear it may not be a fair fight at the moment.

[FUCK THE POLICE]

AC, why the hell do you always go "Why are you so scared? No one can beat me at debate! Just try!".

No one can beat you because no one cares.

[AnyOldIron]

It's fascinating watching Dixie justify terrorism...

"They wear a uniform, it's the other terrorist's fault etc etc.."

Who'd have thought he'd be such a fan of terrorism, not just a fan, but a fully fledged cheerleader, with pompoms and a little skirt...

[toby]

I think it is questionable if they are innocent civilians. They elect terrorist to the goverment. If they stock pile weapons in the basement and rockets in the garage then maybe they are no longer civilians.

[AnyOldIron]

I think it is questionable if they are innocent civilians. They elect terrorist to the goverment. If they stock pile weapons in the basement and rockets in the garage then maybe they are no longer civilians.

Terrorists such as well marked aid convoys?

There are Israel troops in Haifa. Does that justify Hizbollah rocketing the town, killing civilians?

If the target of Israeli terrorism is entirely Hizbollah rocketry in southern Lebanon, why are the Israelis bombarding civilian targets in Beruit?

Why do Israeli cabinet ministers comment that they are giving the Lebanese a piece of what Hizbollah gives it?

[toby]

Who attacked first! Hezbo attacked Israel. Hezbos are a terrorist organization and to make a moral compairsion to a state is without merit,

[evince]

Isreal just bombed a house and killed a woman and 5 kids

[Care4all]

Who attacked first! Hezbo attacked Israel. Hezbos are a terrorist organization and to make a moral compairsion to a state is without merit,

Hezbollah attacked Israeli Soldiers first, about 8 of them in total I believe, and kidnapped two of them.

In this situation, Hezbollah did not attack Jewish citizens.

Israel retaliated, and should have done such.

However, they should not have attacked the Lebanese people as they did, they should have not destroyed their infra structure. If they wanted to root out terrorism and Hezbollah, they should have gone after HEZBOLLAH ONLY....

Even if that took going in on foot, so that the innocent Lebanese were not haphazzardly killed.

Even in their own religion, they are told "an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth....a LIFE for a LIFE taken.....

A handful of people were killed by Hezbollah in the initial attack by them, then those that did the killing should have been killed. NOT killing the near 600 Lebanese INNOCENT, men, women and children.

I can totally understand Israel's predicament...Hezbollah crossing their border and killing and kidnapping 2 of their soldiers, ALL of their surrounding countries have vowed to abolish Israel and push them in to the Sea....and Hezbollah's build up in southern Lebanon was a CLEAR AND EVIDENT THREAT to them and also AGAINST the UN resolution and cease fire that was signed a few years earlier....

but I still believe they have gone too far! Too far because they did not take ENOUGH precautions to not kill innocent men, women, and children.... they should have gone in on foot, to weed out hezbollah, less innocense would have been killed.

[AnyOldIron]

Care4, if we define terrorism as the attacking of civilians and civilian infrastructure for political gain, then both sides are using terrorism.

Both sides have used terrorism since the conception of Israel.

It is sheer hypocrisy that the west supports terrorism on one side and condemns it on another.

[AnyOldIron]

I can totally understand Israel's predicament...Hezbollah crossing their border and killing and kidnapping 2 of their soldiers,

The IDF frequently crosses into PA territory to snatch Palestinians.

Does this justify Palestinian attacks on Israel?

[toby]

You ignore all the rockets the hezbo fired before this incursion. And I think Israel has been restrained. And as I said before, How do you know those killed are civilians? Hezbos don't wear uniforms.

[evince]

Isreal just bombed a home and killed a woman and 6 kids

[Care4all]

Care4, if we define terrorism as the attacking of civilians and civilian infrastructure for political gain, then both sides are using terrorism.

Both sides have used terrorism since the conception of Israel.

It is sheer hypocrisy that the west supports terrorism on one side and condemns it on another.

Thus the Brit Soldiers in Iraq are terrorist???

[Care4all]

You ignore all the rockets the hezbo fired before this incursion. And I think Israel has been restrained. And as I said before, How do you know those killed are civilians? Hezbos don't wear uniforms.


let's see, hmmm....more children have been killed than women and men in Israel's recent attacks in Lebanon....

Oh, I know, you THINK THE CHILDREN ARE RUNNING the terrorist's SHOW....

read a little toby, stop playing the ignorant fellow that I KNOW you are not....

care

[toby]

Israel isn't attacking civilians they are after Hezbo. The terrorist don't make a distinction.

[toby]

If a terrorist takes his family, the wife the kids the family dog on a little outing to fire a rocker at Israel, who's fault is it that they might get hurt?

[toby]

Maybe they should't be firing rockets at Israel from the roof of their homes when the kids are home.

[FUCK THE POLICE]

How is Hezbollah a terrorist group? They don't use terrorist tactics. They're more of a militia. To simply label any group we disagree with and don't like a "terrorist" simply to give them more negative connation degrades the meaning of the word, and actually many dictatorships have used these kinds of language tactics before.

[toby]

What world do you live on Water? Hezbos are not terrorist to you? LOL

[Care4all]

How is Hezbollah a terrorist group? They don't use terrorist tactics. They're more of a militia. To simply label any group we disagree with and don't like a "terrorist" simply to give them more negative connation degrades the meaning of the word, and actually many dictatorships have used these kinds of language tactics before.


ok, if you say they are NOT a terrorist group, then what are they? The Lebanese Government?

[Care4all]

Israel isn't attacking civilians they are after Hezbo. The terrorist don't make a distinction.

If they are going after Hezbollah, then they should NOT be killing any innocent people, AND THEY ARE....?

They should have targeted only Hezbollah, and gone in on foot in areas that are mixed with civilians and innocent bystanders.

[evince]

Arguing with toby is like trying to reason with a tree

[OrnotBitwise]

Arguing with toby is like trying to reason with a tree
No, I don't think so. Trees don't generally whine or insult you. It's more like arguing with a three year old. A three year old chimpanzee, maybe.

:D

[Cypress]

800,000 displaced and homeless civilians = disproportionate response.

Lebanon only has 3 million citizens.

[OrnotBitwise]

800,000 displaced and homeless civilians = disproportionate response.

Lebanon only has 3 million citizens.
I agree.

In general, I think that responding to acts of terrorism by committing acts of terrorism is both immoral and stupid. Even if one disagrees with my moral judgement, it still won't achieve the stated goal, so why argue?

And Israel's incursion into Lebanon in this instance is indeed an act of terrorism. They're trying to terrorize the Lebanese population into expelling Hezbollah. To achieve that goal, they're willing to slaughter hundreds or even thousands of non-combatants.

[Care4all]

I agree.

In general, I think that responding to acts of terrorism by committing acts of terrorism is both immoral and stupid. Even if one disagrees with my moral judgement, it still won't achieve the stated goal, so why argue?

And Israel's incursion into Lebanon in this instance is indeed an act of terrorism. They're trying to terrorize the Lebanese population into expelling Hezbollah. To achieve that goal, they're willing to slaughter hundreds or even thousands of non-combatants.


oh, you mean like what the usa DID BY DROPPING THE ATOMIC BOMB? Are we now rewriting history to call this terrorism as Anyold describes and now you too?

btw, I am against what was done, dropping the bomb....

[OrnotBitwise]

oh, you mean like what the usa DID BY DROPPING THE ATOMIC BOMB? Are we now rewriting history to call this terrorism as Anyold describes and now you too?

btw, I am against what was done, dropping the bomb....
No, I want to undo the rewriting that's already been done.

My grandfather -- both of them, actually, at least indirectly -- helped build the first nukes. My mother grew up at Los Alamos. And yes, I think that using the bomb on Japan was, in effect, an act of terrorism. Aimed at the Soviets, ironically enough, but I digress.

Hezbollah is clearly committing the worst kind of terrorism by lobbing rockets into Israeli cities. No doubt, no argument. These are heinous acts and the perpetrators should probably be strung up by their balls . . . if they could be found and caught. That's the rub.

It's totally understandable that the Israelis are furious and want revenge. Who wouldn't? I would if someone fired a bunch of rockets into San Francisco or New York. Wanting revenge doesn't give you the right to take it, however.

The Israelis are, right now, killing hundreds of innocent Lebanese civilians -- men, women, children and little babies too young to be called anything but innocent -- in order to cull out certain individuals. That's wrong. I'm sorry, but I can't see it any other way. I'm sure that their intentions are good: most of the Israelis would rather not kill any civilians. Their intentions don't cut any mustard, however. They've still decided that those innocent deaths are an acceptable cost for their goal. This judgment makes them no different from the terrorists.

Yes, this does mean that I find any and all preemptive, proactive war immoral. Ours and everybody else's. As far as I'm concerned, the ONLY legitimate use of military force is purely defensive.

[AnyOldIron]

Thus the Brit Soldiers in Iraq are terrorist???

Are Brit soldiers in Iraq targeting civilians and civilian infrastructure with the aim of creating political change via terror?

[toby]

I haven't whined nor have I insulted anyone, seems to me that I am the one being insulted. Typical lib attack and distortion. I made very clear posts that should not be hard to understand.

[toby]

Ornot innocent civilians don't have rockets on the roof of thier homes.

[AnyOldIron]

You ignore all the rockets the hezbo fired before this incursion. And I think Israel has been restrained. And as I said before, How do you know those killed are civilians? Hezbos don't wear uniforms.

[b] To state that Hizbollah firing rockets into Israel started this is to ignore the last sixty years of history.

Israel haven't been restrained, they have acted in the same manner as Hizbollah, targetting civilians.

The IDF is as much a terrorist organisation as Hizbollah.

Hexbollah tend to wear a uniform of sorts. But many of those killed are women and children, entire residential areas devastated.

Are you not watching the news, or is the US news giving it the usual pro-Israel slant?

[toby]

But innocents are killed in wars. Especially when one side uses them as shields. I suggest that all those killed in lebanon are NOT civilians.

[AnyOldIron]

Ornot innocent civilians don't have rockets on the roof of thier homes.

Are you not watching the news? Are women, children and aid workers terrorists now?

Your support and apologetics for Israeli terrorism is shocking.

[AnyOldIron]

But innocents are killed in wars. Especially when one side uses them as shields. I suggest that all those killed in lebanon are NOT civilians.

Innocents should not be targeted in wars. When civilians are targeted with the aim of bringing political change that is terrorism.

Israeli troops are in Haifa, does that justify Hizbollah's rockets?

You are nothing but an apologist for terrorism....

[AnyOldIron]

Israel has rejected a United Nations call for a three-day truce in southern Lebanon, as US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice arrives in Israel.
The UN says children, the elderly and disabled people are trapped and supplies are short.

But an Israeli spokesman said there was no need for a truce as a humanitarian corridor to the area had been opened.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/5226996.stm

[OrnotBitwise]

[b] To state that Hizbollah firing rockets into Israel started
Are you not watching the news, or is the US news giving it the usual pro-Israel slant?
For the most part, major U.S. news outlets are indeed still mechanically pro-Israel. I feel like I'm beginning to see some hitches in the clockwork, but that's purely subjective. They're very few even if I'm right.

[OrnotBitwise]

But innocents are killed in wars. Especially when one side uses them as shields. I suggest that all those killed in lebanon are NOT civilians.
Yes, innocents are killed in wars. That's why war should be avoided at almost any cost.

The Israelis have decided -- or their government has decided: I still hope that their public opinion may swing against it -- that killing innocents is acceptable in pursuit of their "higher" goal. This is exactly the same decision that the leaders of Hezbollah have made.

So, what's your point?

[AnyOldIron]

For the most part, major U.S. news outlets are indeed still mechanically pro-Israel. I feel like I'm beginning to see some hitches in the clockwork, but that's purely subjective. They're very few even if I'm right.

[B] Yeah, I saw ABCNews the other night.

[toby]

Any read the post, don't keep reaping the some old crap. Israel is not targeting civilians, Hezbo is. they just sent three rockets into a daycare center in Israel, Guess that is okay they would be future member of the IDF?

[toby]

Israel tried to avoid war, it just didn't work, they were attacked anyway.

[toby]

Israel was not in Lebanon, they were not in Gaza and yet they are attacked again and again from these areas.

[toby]

Israel offered first, give us back our soldiers and stop firing rockets into the villages and the Hezbos responded with hundreds of rockets.

[toby]

They annonced they are coming after the Hezbo and get out and get away from them, we are coming in...............That is good enough for me.

[AnyOldIron]

Any read the post, don't keep reaping the some old crap. Israel is not targeting civilians, Hezbo is. they just sent three rockets into a daycare center in Israel, Guess that is okay they would be future member of the IDF?

Wrong, both sides are targeting civilians, terrorist fan....

I guess targeting a very well marked aid column is acceptable in case any of the aid feeds children who grow up to join Hizbollah?

[AnyOldIron]

They annonced they are coming after the Hezbo and get out and get away from them, we are coming in...............That is good enough for me.

The IRA used to give warnings before they attacked civilian infrastructure too....

[toby]

What does the IRA have to do with this post? Are they involved? I didn't know that.

[evince]

jesus your stupid

[AnyOldIron]

Toby, if Israeli is only conducting military operations against Hizbollah rockets, why is it bombing civilian areas of Beruit?

Why did the Israelis tell civilians to go north, then shell the roads north trapping them and then helicopters attack civilian vehicle columns leaving the war zone?

Why are ambulances and Red Cross vehicles being targeted?

Why are they attacking well marked aid columns?

[OrnotBitwise]

What does the IRA have to do with this post? Are they involved? I didn't know that.
The IRA (provisional wing) were the prototype for all modern terrorist organizations.

The English and the Irish both know more about terrorism than we do, Tobbes. They've lived through a lot more of it.

[AnyOldIron]

What does the IRA have to do with this post? Are they involved? I didn't know that.

You stated that Israeli terrorism is a-okay because they gave a warning. The IRA also used to give warnings...

[toby]

Read the post. I say Israel is not targeting civilians. Some, maybe, are killed but that is war and is entirely caused by Hezbo.

[OrnotBitwise]

Read the post. I say Israel is not targeting civilians. Some, maybe, are killed but that is war and is entirely caused by Hezbo.
If that's what you say then you're speaking shear idiocy. Either that or you're deliberately lying. I'm inclined toward the latter, but we shall see.

1) Israel is not "targeting" civilians. That means that if any civilians are killed by an Israeli bomb, shell, missile or bullet, the Israelis didn't mean it. Oh gosh, we goofed! So sorry! But Mom, we didn't mean it! Honest!

Rebuttal to point (1): who cares if they're deliberately targeting civilians? At best, it's the same distinction as between first and second degree murder. That's at best. To the families of the innocents killed, I'm sure that it matters even less. Only children think that what one intends to do is more important than the consequences of what one does. I, for one, prefer not to be childish where matters of life and death are concerned.

The proper definitions of terrorism and terrorist acts do not hinge on whether the perpetrator deliberately targets civilians. I'm sure that one could find some online dictionary somewhere that defines it thusly, but that's immaterial. Terrorism is the attempt to terrorize -- hence the name -- a population by violence and military action. Implicit in this is the willingness to cause the deaths and suffering of innocents in pursuit of a "higher" (very sick) goal, but the actual act of killing innocents does not define terrorism either. If the terrorist attacks only military targets, avoiding civilian casualties entirely, it is still terrorism -- e.g. the attack on the U.S.S. Cole.

2) The death of innocents from Israeli military action is "caused" by Hezbollah. This rests upon the premis that Israel has no option but to attack Lebanon if some terrorist group attacks Israel from within Lebanon.

Rebuttal to point (2): this is pure butt excreta. No person in Hezbollah has ever loaded and fired an Israeli artillary piece during this campaign. Okay, okay: it's entirely possible that some Hezbollah infiltrator in the IDF has indeed pushed a button, as it were. In that possibile but highly fanciful case any deaths are on Hezbollah's hands. Whoopie.

The Israeli government had many options for dealing with the up-ratcheted threat from Hezbollah. Only one of those options involved turning babies into hamburger. We've discussed many of them here.

Terrorism is not, properly speaking, a military problem at all. It is a diplomatic, law enforcement and -- most of all -- economic problem.

[Topspin]

If Isreal is killing male citizens that have a high% chance of joining Hezbolah aren't they reducing the number of terrorist in the long term?

[Cypress]

If Isreal is killing male citizens that have a high% chance of joining Hezbolah aren't they reducing the number of terrorist in the long term?

Only about 20-30% of Lebanon is shia muslim. Hezbollah is strictly a shia organization.

The rest of lebanon is christian (about 40%), sunni muslim, and druze.

[OrnotBitwise]

If Isreal is killing male citizens that have a high% chance of joining Hezbolah aren't they reducing the number of terrorist in the long term?
Only if they can significantly cut into the birth rate of the subject population. And that's extremely hard to do, short of truly genocidal efforts.

This fact is counter-intuitive, I freely admit. You and I poke fun at one another all the time, Topspin, but, this time, I'm going to refrain. This is an important point. I only wish Trog were around since he could explain it better than I.

First, I'm going to stipulate that poverty and political repression "cause" -- and I use the word very loosely -- terrorism. That is, terrorist groups rely on a strongly dissaffected population for support. The terrorists by and large don't produce their own food or even earn their own money: they're supported by donations and material from sympathetic civilians. Such a population, one that is angry and frustrated enough to produce a few thousand people willing to support a terrorist group, is usually a poor population and a population that thinks of itself as oppressed.

In any (self identified) oppressed population, anywhere, only a small fraction are going to be motivated to join the actual terrorist group(s). A larger but still small faction will support the terrorists with what money they have and with material support -- e.g. lodging, safe houses, food, and so on. Most of the population will either not support the terrorists or will be too frightened and too conservative to offer them any substantive help. HOWEVER, the proportion of the populace that is willing to help or even join is largely determined by the degree of oppression felt by the people. The more oppressed and downtrodden they feel, the more likely they are to join the terrorist group.

You see where this is going I trust.

Consider this. In less than 20 years, the Russians have killed outright more than 25% of the population of Chechnya. That's an astounding number of dead. And that doesn't even include the wounded. Yet, even with this mind-numbing genocidal onslaught, the Chechen resistance still exists and is, despite the ceasefire, still fighting.

[Care4all]

Toby, if Israeli is only conducting military operations against Hizbollah rockets, why is it bombing civilian areas of Beruit?

Why did the Israelis tell civilians to go north, then shell the roads north trapping them and then helicopters attack civilian vehicle columns leaving the war zone?

Why are ambulances and Red Cross vehicles being targeted?

Why are they attacking well marked aid columns?


NONE of this is being reported in the news over here as you put it...we must be getting censored...?

[AnyOldIron]

"Zeinab, 13, is one of four people still at Tyre's Najm Hospital who survived an ill-fated civilian convoy that left the village of Aitaroun last Friday to escape from one of the most bombed areas in south-east of Lebanon near the Israeli border.

As the convoy's three cars approached Tyre, the first was hit by an air strike, killing everyone on board.

The two remaining cars tried to escape, but one was also hit by an missile, causing more deaths and injuries. "

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/5208110.stm


"The ambulance headlamps were on, the blue light overhead was flashing, and another light illuminated the Red Cross flag when the first Israeli missile hit, shearing off the right leg of the man on the stretcher inside. As he lay screaming beneath fire and smoke, patients and ambulance workers scrambled for safety, crawling over glass in the dark. Then another missile hit the second ambulance."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,,1828142,00.html

"Aid convoy hit in Lebanon as UN accuses Hezbollah"

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,3-2289900,00.html

[FUCK THE POLICE]

ok, if you say they are NOT a terrorist group, then what are they? The Lebanese Government?

They are a militia, as I said, Care. To call them a terrorist group is a bit ridiculous, and if we keep on just labeling groups we don't like terrorists the meaning of the word will be degraded, and it'll be viewed as if we just go out and try to label things terrorist that we don't like instead of things that are actually terrorist organizations.

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

They are a militia, as I said, Care. To call them a terrorist group is a bit ridiculous, and if we keep on just labeling groups we don't like terrorists the meaning of the word will be degraded, and it'll be viewed as if we just go out and try to label things terrorist that we don't like instead of things that are actually terrorist organizations.

To call Hezbollah anything other than a terror organization, shows a level of understanding on the brink of retardation. Surely, you are kidding me, right? Please tell me you are not taking the position that Hezbollah, a group that routinely uses innocent civilian humans as shields, while using terrorist tactics to kill innocent civilians, is anything other than a terror group?

The more I read you morons, the more I am understanding how profoundly ignorant you are, of what terrorism is, what the fundamental problem with it is, why we have to defeat it, or even the most rudimentary logic in the problem we face. You guys really don't have the slightest clue of what we're up against, do you?

I honestly think there are those of you, who will wait until they are sawing off your mother's head in you back yards, before you become concerned or interested in what we are fighting. Are we going to have to have gangs of armed Hezbollah militia's taking over states in America before you people pull your head out of your asses? Because, if you ignore this problem, if you don't fundamentally understand it, or view it as the threat that it is to all mankind, that is exactly the road you are heading down.

[maineman]

"Hezbollah, a resistance group, was inspired by the success of the Islamic Revolution in Iran . It was formed by the Ayatollah Khomeini's followers in the early eighties to spread Shia revolution, and to combat Israeli occupation following the 1982 Lebanon War . Hezbollah views Israel as a whole as "an illegal usurper entity, which is based on falsehood, massacres, and illusions", and follows a distinct version of Islamic Shia ideology developed by Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini, leader of the Islamic Revolution in Iran.
Along with the Amal Movement, Hezbollah is the main political party and military organization representing the Shia community, Lebanon's largest religious bloc. It is also a recognized political party in Lebanon, where it has participated in government. The civilian wing participates in the Parliament of Lebanon, taking nearly 11% of the seats (14 out of 128) and the bloc it forms with others, the Resistance and Development Bloc, 27.3% (see Lebanese general election, 2005). It is a minority partner in the current Cabinet.
Hezbollah not only has armed and political wings but also boasts an extensive social development programme. The civilian wing also runs hospitals, news services, and educational facilities. Its Reconstruction Campaign ('Jihad al-Bina') is responsible for numerous economic and infrastructural development projects in Lebanon. The group currently operates at least four hospitals, 12 clinics, 12 schools, and two agricultural centres that provide farmers with technical assistance and training. It also has an environmental department and an extensive social assistance programme. Medical care is also cheaper than in most of the country's private hospitals and free for Hezbollah members. Most experts believe that Hezbollah's social and health programmes are worth hundreds of millions of dollars annually. Hezbollah mainly gets its money from donations. It is widely thought that Hezbollah receives financial help from Iran and Syria, although Iran denies this, and Hezbollah denies receiving aid from Syria.

Throughout most of the Arab and Muslim worlds, Hezbollah is highly regarded as a legitimate resistance movement. According to a poll released by the "Beirut Center for Research and Information" on 26 July during 2006 Israel-Lebanon conflict, 87 percent of Lebanese support Hezbollah's fight with Israel, a rise of 29 percent on a similar poll conducted in February. More striking, however, is the level of support for Hezbollah's resistance from non-Shiite communities. Eighty percent of Christians polled supported Hezbollah along with 80 percent of Druze and 89 percent of Sunnis.

The Lebanese government confirmed it as a legitimate resistance against occupation.74 percent of Christian Lebanese viewed Hezbollah as a resistance organization.

The United States, Canada and Israel consider Hezbollah a terrorist organization, claiming that the organization initiates attacks against civilians and ideologically supports such attacks by other similar organizations.

The United Kingdom, Australia and the Netherlands officially list only the External Security Organisation of Hezballah (ESO) as a proscribed organisation.

The European Union does not list Hezbollah as a 'terrorist organization', but does list Imad Mugniyah, who is widely believed to be heading the international branch of the Hezbollah. Russia does not consider Hezbollah as a terrorist organization .

In a non-binding resolution adopted by the European Parliament on 10 March 2005, The EU Parliament considered that clear evidence exists of terrorist activities by Hezbollah and recommended that 'The EU Council should take all necessary steps to curtail them'. MEPs urged the EU Council to classify Hezbollah as a terrorist organisation. However, the Council is reluctant to do so."
[from wikipedia]

To talk of gangs of "Hezbollah militias taking over states in America" is yet another in a long long line of flatulent idiocies from Dixie which prove that simple people who remain determined to see the world in binary, black and white images devoid of nuance should NEVER be allowed to implement America's foreign policy let alone determine it!

[AnyOldIron]

Hizbollah are a terrorist organisation.

The IDF are a terrorist organisation.

[AnyOldIron]

The more I read you morons, the more I am understanding how profoundly ignorant you are, of what terrorism is, what the fundamental problem with it is, why we have to defeat it, or even the most rudimentary logic in the problem we face. You guys really don't have the slightest clue of what we're up against, do you?

Dixie, what the fuck do you know?

You're a terrorist supporter, as long as they look like us and use our weapons.

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

The more I read you morons, the more I am understanding how profoundly ignorant you are, of what terrorism is, what the fundamental problem with it is, why we have to defeat it, or even the most rudimentary logic in the problem we face. You guys really don't have the slightest clue of what we're up against, do you?

Dixie, what the fuck do you know?

You're a terrorist supporter, as long as they look like us and use our weapons.


Well Arnold, if you really think that, it's fine. I can live with what the US has done, and I can live with supporting who I support. If you want to think of the US and Israel as a terrorist nations, and Hezbollah as some disenfranchised militia group, you go right ahead. It doesn't have anything to do with who looks like whom, or who's weapons are being used.

Hezbollah is a radical Islamic fundamentalist terror group, just like Hamaas, alQaeda, Islamic Jihad, AbuNidal, AlAxa, the Taliban, etc. They attacked Israel just as we were attacked by alQaeda. They killed 244 Marines in 1983 when they bombed the Marine barracks, and claimed responsibility for endless terror attacks. They have currently fired over 2,000 missiles into civilian population centers of Israel, killing and injuring thousands of innocent Jews. They kidnapped 2 Israeli soldiers and demanded the release of 150 Hezbo cronies who were tried and convicted of inflicting, attempting to inflict acts of terror on Israel. They have targeted Holy sites with glee, as they hid their weapons in Mosques and hospitals. They have no regard whatsoever, for the Geneva Convention, the UN, or any authority other than their Mullah's and Clerics, and their twisted perversions of Islam. They can not be negotiated with, and in fact, state very clearly in their doctrine, they will use your 'diplomatic efforts' to benefit their ultimate objectives, and take advantage of every opportunity. Those who think we can somehow barter peace with these people are insane, those who think they are not a terror organization, are insane fools.

[AnyOldIron]

Well Arnold, if you really think that, it's fine. I can live with what the US has done, and I can live with supporting who I support. If you want to think of the US and Israel as a terrorist nations, and Hezbollah as some disenfranchised militia group, you go right ahead.

Your rhetoric is weak Dixie.

I don't say Hizbollah is a militia group, I say it is a terrorist group.

So is the IDF. The US is a terrorism finiancier and falicitator, like Syria or Iran.

Terrorism is targeting civilians in the effort to create political change through terror.

Any words in there you want me to define for you?

In the current situation, both sides are using terrorism, as they both have largely for decades.

The hypocrisy stands where those, such as yourself, decry terrorism only when it is not done with your approval.

Ironically, we know that Hizbollah is Syria and Iran's bitch whilst in the opposing corner, the US is certainly Israel's bitch.

Because the US has gone back to 'Arden Pyle' mode...

It's embarrassing to the Anglosphere...

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

The US is a terrorism finiancier and falicitator, like Syria or Iran.

I think we did finance and facilitate terrorist organizations at one time, particularly when Hillary was swooning over Arafat's wife, but that was well before the events of 9/11. There is no hypocrisy, except what you want to manufacture by painting Israel as a terror group. They simply are not. Neither is the US. I think you need to gain some understanding of what constitutes "terrorism" because you seem to not be able to draw distinction between "terrorism" and defending democracy.

[AnyOldIron]

There is no hypocrisy, except what you want to manufacture by painting Israel as a terror group. They simply are not. Neither is the US. I think you need to gain some understanding of what constitutes "terrorism" because you seem to not be able to draw distinction between "terrorism" and defending democracy.

Blah, Blah, Blah. All throth and no coffee...

I defined terrorism, the accepted definition of terrorism. I even asked if their were any terms which you don't comprehend.

Here's a lesson for you Dixie, call it in Philosophy...

To not be deemed a hypocrit, use the same criteria for judging both sides...

Terrorism is targeting civilians in the aim to reach a political goal through terrorism.

Now, let's hear your defense of Israeli terrorism, let's see the hypocrisy in the criteria you use to judge both sides....

[Goodlookingfundamentalist]

It’s simply this: In the past, each fissure was on a different plane, with differing consequences, occurring at different times. Now, the globe seems to have rotated in such a way that the fissures — and the anger they generate — are coming into dangerous alignment.

Each of the lines of conflict — the vast economic chasms, the deep cultural voids, the wide political divisions, the die-hard religious and ethnic hatreds — are coming into synch along one axis and with one by-product: violent change.

With the war in Iraq and the latest blow-up in the Middle East, radical movements are gaining far more prestige, public support and financing. Moderate leaders, meanwhile, are losing public support, even becoming a laughing stock.

The impact is self-evident:

[AnyOldIron]

It's certainly boom-time for every lunatic who wants to make the world his personal utopia and is willing to back that up with explosives.

It's full moon time...

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

To not be deemed a hypocrit, use the same criteria for judging both sides...

Terrorism is targeting civilians in the aim to reach a political goal through terrorism.

Now, let's hear your defense of Israeli terrorism, let's see the hypocrisy in the criteria you use to judge both sides....

I don't know that I can defend something that doesn't exist. Israeli's aren't strapping bombs to their kids and sending them into Muslim markets to kill innocent Muslims. Israel isn't kidnapping people and making demands for their safe release. Israel isn't intentionally targeting civilian population centers to inflict terror on innocent people, they have never expressed a desire to rid the world of Muslims and their religion does not condone killing all Muslims in the name of their deity. So, I am not sure what you expect from me in terms of an argument, I can't present something that doesn't exist, and a defense of Israeli terrorism, is something of an oxymoron.

[AnyOldIron]

Dixie, do you think that targeting civilians in the effort to create political change through terror only consists of suicide bombers?

Israel is terrorising, it is targeting civilians (the evidence of which is all over any reputable news broadcaster) in the effort to create political change through terror.

They are doing it with artillery with missiles and aircraft.

It doesn't matter if you wear a uniform or use western weapons.

So why don't you get off the side of terrorism Dixie and join in condemnation of terrorism on both sides?

Surely you can't justify supporting terrorism?

[gonzojournals]

Thank God one other person on Earth recognizes Israel as a terrorist state.

[maineman]

I am not so sure they are a "terrorist" state as they are a bunch of tough motherfuckers who will NEVER give up their country and will never allow themselves to be herded anywhere ever again. They are surrounded by enemies and are convinced - and rightfully so - that the rest of the world does not really like them.... and they, therefore, could really give a fuck what the rest of the world thinks about their actions. They are gonna bitchslap arabs every time they get too uppity... but they DO show a remarkably callous disregard for the fact that their actions cause incredible amounts of "collateral" casualties... but from their perspective, they KNOW that all the arabs really hate them and want them out of the holy lands...and they know that they will never go... so really, from Israel's deepest darkest perspective, the only good arab is a dead one, because they know that muslim arabs, at least, will never agree to let the state of Israel live in peace.

[Goodlookingfundamentalist]

Iraq: The Pentagon has just extended the tour of 4,000 U.S. troops, expanding the total number in Iraq. But now the troops have a new, far tougher mission:

Instead of just putting down an insurgency, they also have to stop a civil war. Instead of fighting one amorphous enemy, they’re fighting many — jihadists, Shiite militias and often, even corrupt government forces themselves.

Last week, Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri Maliki told Congress that, if the U.S. loses in Iraq, it will be a monumental victory for worldwide terrorism, an event that could be tragic in its consequences.

What he failed to mention, however, is the corollary tragedy: Even if the U.S. prevails in Iraq, it could be a victory for Iran.

Reason: The U.S. has little more than a short-term alliance with the Shiite leaders of Iraq, based on convenience and expediency. In contrast, Iran has a long-term alliance with the Shiite leaders, based on decades of mutual suffering against Saddam ... long years of joint training exercises ... deeply shared religious beliefs ... and intimate contacts that continue to this very day.

Iran: When most Americans see the news of war between Lebanon and Israel, they still don’t make the connection to the looming conflict with Iran. But others do.

In Tehran this weekend, Iranian officials, former officials and analysts said a conflict with the West is now so likely they’re deathly afraid to even talk about it. Their interpretation: Israel’s war against the Hezbollah in Lebanon is actually America’s first salvo in its coming war against Iran.

The view coming out of Washington this week is very similar, but in reverse: Hezbollah was created by Iran, financed by Iran and armed by Iran. Hezbollah is Iran’s front line. Ergo, Hezbollah’s incursion into Israel is Iran’s way of attacking the West.

Connect the dots, and you’ll see that, indirectly, Iran and U.S. are already at war.

[AnyOldIron]

I am not so sure they are a "terrorist" state as they are a bunch of tough motherfuckers who will NEVER give up their country and will never allow themselves to be herded anywhere ever again.

The same could be said of Hizbollah. That doesn't make them any less a terrorist group. Same with the IRA.

[Damocles]

I am not so sure they are a "terrorist" state as they are a bunch of tough motherfuckers who will NEVER give up their country and will never allow themselves to be herded anywhere ever again.

The same could be said of Hizbollah. That doesn't make them any less a terrorist group. Same with the IRA.

Red looks good on you, AOI!

[AnyOldIron]

Red looks good on you, AOI!

I've only just noticed! What does that signify?

[Damocles]

Red looks good on you, AOI!

I've only just noticed! What does that signify?

That you are a warrior for an upcoming debate... You can also view the warriors in the Leadership area.

[AnyOldIron]

That you are a warrior for an upcoming debate... You can also view the warriors in the Leadership area

Cool! I'm going to smear dirt on my face and sharpen a stick.... I can feel the testosterone rising....

[Damocles]

That you are a warrior for an upcoming debate... You can also view the warriors in the Leadership area

Cool! I'm going to smear dirt on my face and sharpen a stick.... I can feel the testosterone rising....



Maybe I made the change too early...

;)

[AnyOldIron]

Maybe I made the change too early...

Too late. My armour is being delivered this afternoon...

Let the Hundred Years War begin... :)

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Israel is terrorising, it is targeting civilians (the evidence of which is all over any reputable news broadcaster) in the effort to create political change through terror.

This is not so. Israel is targeting Hezbollah, who is deliberately hiding in places where civilians will be killed when they strike. It is a tactic they are well-known for.

[maineman]

I am not so sure they are a "terrorist" state as they are a bunch of tough motherfuckers who will NEVER give up their country and will never allow themselves to be herded anywhere ever again.

The same could be said of Hizbollah. That doesn't make them any less a terrorist group. Same with the IRA.

I don't think that lebanese shiites have a centuries old tradition of being whipping boys for any and every other religious and political entity in the hemisphere. I don't recall Germany killing seven million Lebanese shiites in gas chambers simply because they were lebanese shiites. The shrinking cowards of the eastern european ghettos have risen like the phoenix and are the young lions of Israel. They will NEVER be pushed around or herded ever again and they are tougher than arabs - hands down.

Hezbollah has used the six years since Israelis pulled out of Lebanon to fortify the south and get ready to wage war against Israel. Israel would leave Hezbollah and Hamas and all of Lebanon and Syria and Jordan and Egypt and all of Islam ALONE if they would do likewise.

I firmly believe that if we could internationalize Jerusalem and GUARANTEE Jews that they would forever have access to the western wall and GUARANTEE muslims that they would forever have access to the Dome of the Rock and Christians to the Church of the Holy Sepulchre, the major roadblock to peace could be dismantled.

[robdastud]

maybe we should tell em what good ol "Mel" said!!!

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

maybe we should tell em what good ol "Mel" said!!!

I think maingey is a big believer in the booze talking for you.

[maineman]

and your excuse for accusing ME of pedophilia is WHAT?

[Damocles]

Battle away... But stop with the pederast references people!

[maineman]

tell him that...I have not accused him of ANYTHING on here.... either make him behave or ban his sorry ass