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Thread: Setting the record straight: Clinton Obama experience

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    Default Setting the record straight: Clinton Obama experience

    Obama's Experience vs. Clinton's Experience
    News Type: Event — Wed Feb 6, 2008 6:06 PM EST


    A lot has been made of Hillary Clinton's experience, it is the theme of her campaign. Knowing a lot about Hillary, but little about what experience she has, I decided I would investigate her experience and compare it to Obama's experience. I got the idea from a comment I saw, I don't remember exactly where, that listed Obama and Clinton's legislative experience.

    EXHIBIT 1: LEGISLATIVE EXPERIENCE

    To begin with let's look at both of their Elected Office experiences. Clinton was first elected to Office in 2000 in the State of New York, a state she had never resided in prior to her run for Senate. Obama was first elected to Office in 1996 in Illinois, a state he had lived and worked in for 7 years. He served in that capacity until 2004 when we was then elected to the US Senate from Illinois.

    Right off the bat we can all see that Clinton has 8 years of experience as a legislator, while Obama has 12 years of experience. So Obama has 4 more years of Legislative/Elected Official experience than Clinton.

    EXHIBIT 2: PRE-LAW SCHOOL EXPERIENCE

    Both have additional work experience. After graduating from Columbia University with a BA in Political Science (emphasis in International Relations), Obama worked for Business International Corporation, as a research associate in the general intenatioanl business information division (NY). He then switched jobs and went to work for the New York Public Interest Research Group, a non-partisan activist organization started by Ralph Nader. Obama then moved to Chicago.

    From 1985-1988 Obama worked as a grassroots neighborhood organizer on the South Side of Chicago. He worked primarily with two public housing projects to start college prep programs, job training programs and other community oriented activities.

    Hillary Clinton graduated from Wellesley College with a BA in Political Science. During college Hillary participated in the following political activities: President Young Republicans, Interned for House Republican Conference, Assisted Nelson Rockefeller's Campaign, Attended the 1968 Republican National Convention.

    Hillary went to Alaska after she graduated. She worked as a dishwasher and salmon canner where she was fired for complaining about working conditions. She then went straight to Law School

    EXHIBIT 3: LAW SCHOOL EXPERIENCE

    Starting at Yale in the fall of 1969 and graduating in 1973. In law school she: was editor for Yale Review of Law and Social Action; worked for New Haven Legal Services; was awarded a research grant to work on Edleman's Washington Research Project where she was assigned to Walter Mondale in order to research migrant worker problems; Interned at Oakland Law Firm Treuhaft, Walker and Burnstein; Campaigned in Texas for McGovern.

    Obama then went to Harvard Law School in 1988. While at Harvard Obama received national headlines for becoming the First African-American President of Harvard Law Review. He graduated Magna Cum Laude.

    EXHIBIT 4: POST-LAW SCHOOL EXPERIENCE

    After earning his JD from Harvard, Obama moved back to Chicago to work on Illinois Project Vote, which resulted in 150k newly registered voters in Cook County (Chicago). In 1993 he went to work for Miner, Barnhill and Galland. At that firm he worked on voter rights and employment litigation, real estate transactions involving not-for-profits and low income and mixed income housing projects. He also served during this time as general counsel for local Health Clinics, Social Service Agencies and Charter Schools.

    Also in 1993 Barack became a legal professor at the University of Chicago. He taught constitutional law. He continued to work at the Law School up until the time he was elected to the US Senate.

    After earning her JD from Yale, Clinton worked as a member of the impeachment inquiry staff in DC. In 1974 she failed the DC Bar Exam and decided to move to Arkansas where Bill was running for congress. He did not succeed in this campaign. Both of them took jobs with the Arkansas University, Fayetteville Law School. By 1977, Bill had won the Arkansas Attorney General campaign and Hillary had earned a job with the Rose Law Firm in Little Rock. She continued to be involved politically, urging new laws to recognize children's rights, but her law practice focused on Patent Infringement and Intellectual Property law, though she rarely set foot in a court room.

    In 1977 Carter appointed Hillary to the board of Directors of the Legal Services Corporation, where she served from 1978-1981. This is the first in a series of corporate boards that Hillary has served on. In 1978 She became First Lady of Arkansas. The next year she was made a full partner at Rose Law Firm. From 1982-1992, while First Lady of Arkansas, she chaired the Arkansas Educational Standards Committee. By her final year with Rose Law Firm Hillary was earning over $200k per year.

    During this period she also served on two not-for-profit boards as chair of the Children's Defense Fund and as a member of the Arkansas Children's Hospital Legal Services. In addition to these non-profit boards, she also served on a number of Corporate Boards: TCBY (1985-1992); Wal-Mart Stores (1986-1992); Lafarge (1990-1992). Both TCBY and Wal-Mart were clients of Rose Law Firm during her tenure on the boards. She did not try to change Wal-Mart's anti-labor union practices while on the board and was unsuccessful in trying to get more women added to the company's management. During Bill's 1986 reelection campaign her employment with Rose Law Firm came under fire because the Rose Law did business for the state.

    In 1993 Hillary became First Lady. She tried unsuccessfully to get health care reform passed (it was never even given a floor vote). She also helped to create the Office of Violence Against Women under the DOJ; helped get sCHIPS passed and initiated the Adoption and Safe Families Act. In 2000 she was elected as a US Senator from NY, a state she had never resided in prior to her campaign.

    CONCLUSION

    Both candidates have extensive work histories. Obama has never worked for corporate America, except for his time with Business International Corporation, which was later bought by the Economist. The law firm he worked for focused primarily on assisting not-for-profits partnering up with corporations to provide low and mixed income housing in poor communities throughout Chicago.

    Most of Obama's work life has focused on helping the poor communities on the South Side of Chicago. He has a history as a grassroots organizer and that is how he was first elected to the Illinois Senate, as a grassroots candidate (along with some challenging names on petitions of his competitors, getting them removed from the ballot). He failed in his run for Congress against Bobby Rush, an entrenched political powerhouse on the South Side of Chicago. Obama ran for elected office for the first time only 5 years after graduating from law school and only 13 years after graduating from College.

    Hillary has done a lot of work for children's rights and other pro bono work. She did this work while working for on of the premier law firms in Little Rock, Rose Law Firm. Rose Law Firm focuses primarily on corporate litigation and transactions. She worked primarily on patent infringement and intellectual property litigation, though she did not do much court work. Rose Law Firm is well entrenched in Arkansas' business and political institutions.

    She is also credited as being the most politically involved First Lady since Eleanore Roosevelt. Despite this fact, she failed in her effort to pass Health Care Reform in 1994. She contemplated a run for Governor in Arkansas in 1988 but decided against it when polls showed she would fight an uphill battle, so Bill ran again. She then ran for Office for the first time 27 years after graduating from law school and 31 years after graduating from college. She ran in a state she never lived in prior to her establishment of residency in the state in January of 2000.

    I wanted to lay out each candidates experiences so that voters can judge for themselves which candidate has BETTER experience.

    SOURCES:

    OBAMA CV

    Clinton Wikipedia Entry

    Obama Wikipedia Entry

    Rose Law Firm

    NYTIMES Article 9/7/200
    Q: Senator Obama, would you take the same pledge? No tax increases on people under $250,000?

    OBAMA: I not only have pledged not to raise their taxes, I've been the first candidate in this race to specifically say I would cut their taxes.

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    Are we ignoring that Obama got elected in his home state by running unopposed?
    “I have never made but one prayer to God, a very short one: "O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous." And God granted it.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by gonzojournals View Post
    Are we ignoring that Obama got elected in his home state by running unopposed?
    Or that in order to get in unopposed he undercut a local civil rights icon?
    Excellence is an art won by training and habituation. We do not act rightly because we have virtue or excellence, but rather we have those because we have acted rightly. We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit.
    - -- Aristotle

    Believe nothing on the faith of traditions, even though they have been held in honor for many generations and in diverse places. Do not believe a thing because many people speak of it. Do not believe on the faith of the sages of the past. Do not believe what you yourself have imagined, persuading yourself that a God inspires you. Believe nothing on the sole authority of your masters and priests. After examination, believe what you yourself have tested and found to be reasonable, and conform your conduct thereto.
    - -- The Buddha

    It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.
    - -- Aristotle

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    Quote Originally Posted by Damocles View Post
    Or that in order to get in unopposed he undercut a local civil rights icon?
    Or that there is a vast difference between state and federal legislature?
    “I have never made but one prayer to God, a very short one: "O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous." And God granted it.”

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    Hell, I could get elected to state legislature...all you have to do to get elected to state legislature is have an interest in state legislature and the ability to breathe.
    “I have never made but one prayer to God, a very short one: "O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous." And God granted it.”

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    Bush doubled the debt from 5 trillion to 10 trillion.
    Proving tax cuts work!

    Bush asked for and signed for the TARP money.
    The Republican senate leader backed Bush on this.

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    its not rocket science here. look at the motivation.. the moves they made in there careers. who's chasing money.
    Q: Senator Obama, would you take the same pledge? No tax increases on people under $250,000?

    OBAMA: I not only have pledged not to raise their taxes, I've been the first candidate in this race to specifically say I would cut their taxes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chapdog View Post
    its not rocket science here. look at the motivation.. the moves they made in there careers. who's chasing money.
    It isn't rocket science, you are right. Anyone with enough of a brain to look at Obama as a candidate instead of a special interest that college kids can't wait to fellate can tell that he is ill-prepared and full of shit.
    “I have never made but one prayer to God, a very short one: "O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous." And God granted it.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by gonzojournals View Post
    It isn't rocket science, you are right. Anyone with enough of a brain to look at Obama as a candidate instead of a special interest that college kids can't wait to fellate can tell that he is ill-prepared and full of shit.
    how is he ill prepared
    Last edited by Chapdog; 02-07-2008 at 02:10 PM.
    Q: Senator Obama, would you take the same pledge? No tax increases on people under $250,000?

    OBAMA: I not only have pledged not to raise their taxes, I've been the first candidate in this race to specifically say I would cut their taxes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chapdog View Post
    its not rocket science here. look at the motivation.. the moves they made in there careers. who's chasing money.

    Your point is well-taken by people with brains.

    That whining you hear coming from the right are the death throes of a dying ideology.

    Pay it no attention.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackascoal View Post
    Your point is well-taken by people with brains.

    That whining you hear coming from the right are the death throes of a dying ideology.

    Pay it no attention.
    A. You have a lot of people on the left who are voting for Hillary over Obama based on the supposive experience issue so you need to check your partisanship at the door on that one my brother.

    B. And free markets and limited government is not an idea that's going away.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cawacko View Post
    A. You have a lot of people on the left who are voting for Hillary over Obama based on the supposive experience issue so you need to check your partisanship at the door on that one my brother.

    B. And free markets and limited government is not an idea that's going away.
    I don't disagree with anthing you've said here .. except putting away my "partisanship." I'm not a democrat.

    The idea of free markets and limited government have been around for a long time, but they have yet to be adopted into reality, nor in my opinion should they.

    Free markets .. two words .. robber barons.

    Limited government .. one word .. reality.

    Life is dynamic my brother, not static, not stuck 200 years in the past.

    The question for Clinton comes down to the question of how to stop a movement .. experience aside.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackascoal View Post
    I don't disagree with anthing you've said here .. except putting away my "partisanship." I'm not a democrat.

    The idea of free markets and limited government have been around for a long time, but they have yet to be adopted into reality, nor in my opinion should they.

    Free markets .. two words .. robber barons.

    Limited government .. one word .. reality.

    Life is dynamic my brother, not static, not stuck 200 years in the past.

    The question for Clinton comes down to the question of how to stop a movement .. experience aside.
    Yes. Life is dynamic. Which is why we are free to reject the notion that greater and more horrific forms of internationalist fascism are the only course for mankind.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AssHatZombie View Post
    Yes. Life is dynamic. Which is why we are free to reject the notion that greater and more horrific forms of internationalist fascism are the only course for mankind.
    You are as free as a bird to reject any notion you choose .. but the moving finger has written, and life is moving away from the notion of imperialism and pure capitialism.

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    People who think the right is "a dying ideology" really are stupid. The ideologies we currently have are pretty much the same ideological differences that the founding fathers dealt with.

    To herald the death of the conservatives because of a fuck-up President and possible (but, because of their stupidity, not for certain) Democratic victory this election is just foolish and reveals you as a party yes-man rather than an intelligent voter.
    “I have never made but one prayer to God, a very short one: "O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous." And God granted it.”

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