Reply With QuoteOriginally Posted by Damocles
This is like a debate about whether Spiderman could kick the tooth fairy's ass.
What matters is whether "it" exists in the first instance. The national health ID card doesn't exist.
Thrillhouse
Contrary to the OP, there is no such thing as a "national health id card." And contrary to your post, the bill doesn't say that anyone will be issued anything. The bill merely allows health insurers to use machine readable id cards.
Thrillhouse
This is like a debate about whether Spiderman could kick the tooth fairy's ass.
What matters is whether "it" exists in the first instance. The national health ID card doesn't exist.
rebel
so am I reading this part wrong?
bill explicitly states that in order for any individual to be eligible for a health insurance plan and health claim status, they will be issued a machine readable national health identification card
A sad commentary on we, as a people, and our viewpoint of our freedom can be summed up like this. We have liberals and conservatives, Democrats and Republicans, yet those very people look at Constitutionalists as radical and extreme.................so those liberals and conservatives, Democrats and Republicans must believe that the constitution is radical and extreme.
Thrillhouse
No, you're reading that part right. I think your trouble is in believing that it is a true statement. It isn't. It's a lie.
rebel
so topspin posted a lie?
A sad commentary on we, as a people, and our viewpoint of our freedom can be summed up like this. We have liberals and conservatives, Democrats and Republicans, yet those very people look at Constitutionalists as radical and extreme.................so those liberals and conservatives, Democrats and Republicans must believe that the constitution is radical and extreme.
Thrillhouse
Yes, he did. He copied and pasted it from some nutter website.
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JPP Staff
Page 62 of the Act has nothing to do with Subsection 1104...
I wonder what copy they are looking at?
Excellence is an art won by training and habituation. We do not act rightly because we have virtue or excellence, but rather we have those because we have acted rightly. We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit.
- -- Aristotle
Believe nothing on the faith of traditions, even though they have been held in honor for many generations and in diverse places. Do not believe a thing because many people speak of it. Do not believe on the faith of the sages of the past. Do not believe what you yourself have imagined, persuading yourself that a God inspires you. Believe nothing on the sole authority of your masters and priests. After examination, believe what you yourself have tested and found to be reasonable, and conform your conduct thereto.
- -- The Buddha
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.
- -- Aristotle
"Health plan and health claim status transactions shall be adopted not later than July 1, 2011, in a manner ensuring that such operating rules are effective not later than January 1, 2013, and may allow for the use of a machine readable identification card"....
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JPP Staff
Yeah, that's on page 30 of the copy I'm looking at. I'm just wondering if they just make up page numbers for that crap...
http://burgess.house.gov/UploadedFil...e_law_2010.pdf
Excellence is an art won by training and habituation. We do not act rightly because we have virtue or excellence, but rather we have those because we have acted rightly. We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit.
- -- Aristotle
Believe nothing on the faith of traditions, even though they have been held in honor for many generations and in diverse places. Do not believe a thing because many people speak of it. Do not believe on the faith of the sages of the past. Do not believe what you yourself have imagined, persuading yourself that a God inspires you. Believe nothing on the sole authority of your masters and priests. After examination, believe what you yourself have tested and found to be reasonable, and conform your conduct thereto.
- -- The Buddha
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.
- -- Aristotle
Sweet Jane
Yes Damo....that is exactly what it would be used for....and in this case....that is a very good thing. Now before you get your "Big brother is evil and can't do anything right" panties in a wad try reasoning.
The main purpose for this card is so that not only can the hospital identify you as a person, it also scans the data for your medical records. Making them portable in a standard formant. Not only will any physician you wish to see or have to see (as in an emergency) will have complete access to the patients history, pre-existing conditions, treatments recieved, how they responded, medicines perscribed in the past and currenlty being used, their interactions with the patient, complications, allergic reactions, etc, etc,. It also provides all the past billing data providing easier and standard access into billing and payment.
So with this scannable card an persons entire medical history becomes protable. It become THEIR property and not the property of the Doctor that treated them or the Hospital or Clinic where they were treated. It provides instant information for a physician who may be unaware that you are on a prescription that could interact badly with a prescription that they would like to prescribe. Emergency room physicians and staff would have immediate life saving information about that persons medical history available at their fingertips. Physicians treating life threatening illnesses can immeadiatly access a patients entire medical history so they can make quick life saving decisions. Had an MRI taken of your bad back 10 years ago? They have immeadiate access to that too after you have a car accident. Not only that but you would also be able to collect data, objectively, on medical procedures, tests, operations, modalities and drug prescriptions to not only determine their efficacy but their true costs and the actual value being recieved for that cost by consumers/patiens.
So before ya'll get on your "Government can't do anything right" soap box consider this. Yes, this sort of information technology and identification system can certainly be abused by persons in power and the appropriate laws and regulations will need to be implemented to prevent such abuses. Having said that, the benefits that it would provide to individuals, health care professionals, emergency professional and public health care institutions are staggering in the positive benefits that can be provided by making a patients medical history portable and standardized as can be done by utilizing this technology.
I'd challenge you to research the benefits of such sytems being used in Hong Kong and Taiwan who utilize such national health care scannable ID cards and the very real benefits they provide before you discount them out of hand on some uninformed libertarian rant. I bet if you asked any licensed physician in this nation that if we could issue national health care scannable ID cards that make an patients entire medical history and data available to them that 99.9999% of them would ask to start issuing them yesterday!
Last edited by Mott the Hoople; 12-30-2011 at 04:01 PM.
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Sweet Jane
It doesn't surprize me. To be honest, if most people would become objectively informed about the benefits of scannable health ID cards I think they'd like the idea. It would certainly help reduce cost but more importantly it would save a lot of lives and that's something a reasonable person cannot disregard out of hand. As a health care consumer and patient I love the fact that not only will I be able to provide any physician with my entire medical history and data but that I will be the owner of that history and data and that I can carry it with me anywhere I go.
You're Never Alone With A Schizophrenic!
rebel
and this is why you are part of the EVIL axis of government entities. the SS number system was implemented with full disclosure that it wouldn't be used for tracking purposes, is now used for tracking purposes because you think it's a good thing. Just like the PATRIOT ACT was passed with full disclosure that it would only be used for terrorism related investigations, but is now used mainly for drug investigations because you think it's a good thing. I tell ya what, fuck you and your big brother bullshit reasoning. when are you getting your ID chip implanted?
A sad commentary on we, as a people, and our viewpoint of our freedom can be summed up like this. We have liberals and conservatives, Democrats and Republicans, yet those very people look at Constitutionalists as radical and extreme.................so those liberals and conservatives, Democrats and Republicans must believe that the constitution is radical and extreme.
Banned
If clowns other than legion dune think we can have obama care without id's please raise your hand so I can laugh in your face too.
Banned
Bs obuma care requires id
Banned
Guess they didn't teach you much at welding school legion dune!
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