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Thread: universal health care is a must

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    I'm betting that universal healthcare does not get passed in Obama's first .. and maybe only term.

    You wanted a centrist and you got one. Just keep in mind that centrists don't stand on principle or doing what is right .. only what is easy.

    They'll claim they don't have the money to do it.
    AMERICAN HISTORY ITSELF IS A TESTAMENT TO THE STRENGTH AND RESILIENCE OF AFRICAN PEOPLE. WE, ALONG WITH THE COURGE AND SACRIFICES OF CONSCIOUS WHITE AMERICANS, LIKE VIOLA LIUZZO, EVERETT DIRKSEN, AND MANY OTHERS, HAVE FOUGHT AND DIED TOGETHER FOR OUR FREEDOM, AND FOR OUR SURVIVAL.

    In America, rights are are not determined by what is just, fair, equitable, honest, nor by what Jesus would do. Rights are determined ONLY by what you can DEMAND.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackascoal View Post
    I'm betting that universal healthcare does not get passed in Obama's first .. and maybe only term.

    You wanted a centrist and you got one. Just keep in mind that centrists don't stand on principle or doing what is right .. only what is easy.

    They'll claim they don't have the money to do it.
    With the economy tanking at record speeds, not having the money may not be a claim. It may be the truth.

    Maybe the idea is to get more people unemployed and without insurance, then a flu epidemic can wipe out more people, reducing the resources needed to keep us going.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackascoal View Post
    I'm betting that universal healthcare does not get passed in Obama's first .. and maybe only term.

    You wanted a centrist and you got one. Just keep in mind that centrists don't stand on principle or doing what is right .. only what is easy.

    They'll claim they don't have the money to do it.

    Well, that's fine since Obama did not campaign on a promise of enacting universal healthcare. It was the key distinguishing feature of his proposal as compared to Clinton and Edwards. Obama's plan was only universal for children.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Solitary View Post
    With the economy tanking at record speeds, not having the money may not be a claim. It may be the truth.

    Maybe the idea is to get more people unemployed and without insurance, then a flu epidemic can wipe out more people, reducing the resources needed to keep us going.
    Universal healthcare would cost FAR less than what the American people just gave away to rich people in a "bailout" .. that isn't working.

    It isn't the money, it's the will .. that's what won't be there.
    AMERICAN HISTORY ITSELF IS A TESTAMENT TO THE STRENGTH AND RESILIENCE OF AFRICAN PEOPLE. WE, ALONG WITH THE COURGE AND SACRIFICES OF CONSCIOUS WHITE AMERICANS, LIKE VIOLA LIUZZO, EVERETT DIRKSEN, AND MANY OTHERS, HAVE FOUGHT AND DIED TOGETHER FOR OUR FREEDOM, AND FOR OUR SURVIVAL.

    In America, rights are are not determined by what is just, fair, equitable, honest, nor by what Jesus would do. Rights are determined ONLY by what you can DEMAND.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Solitary View Post
    I am saying that the military has had a blank check for too long. We are still cranking out the highest tech bombers and submarines like the cold war was still going on. We don't need to spend that much on defense.

    Cut that budget and shift that to actually taking care of americans instead of killing foreigners.
    There are Russian warships currently off the coast of Venezuela, India and Pakistan are threatening to to play a game of Nuclear Tag, Iran has vowed to destroy Israel, and Russia is acting more and more like the former Soviet Union, but you think this is a good time to cut our military budget because we don't need bombers? People like you give me a headache! It's amazing to me this country has survived as long as it has!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dungheap View Post
    Well, that's fine since Obama did not campaign on a promise of enacting universal healthcare. It was the key distinguishing feature of his proposal as compared to Clinton and Edwards. Obama's plan was only universal for children.
    Do you have Obama underwear, an Obama nightlite, or do you sleep with a big ol' Obama teddy?

    “I am absolutely determined that by the end of the first term of the next president, we should have universal health care in this country,”

    Who said that?
    AMERICAN HISTORY ITSELF IS A TESTAMENT TO THE STRENGTH AND RESILIENCE OF AFRICAN PEOPLE. WE, ALONG WITH THE COURGE AND SACRIFICES OF CONSCIOUS WHITE AMERICANS, LIKE VIOLA LIUZZO, EVERETT DIRKSEN, AND MANY OTHERS, HAVE FOUGHT AND DIED TOGETHER FOR OUR FREEDOM, AND FOR OUR SURVIVAL.

    In America, rights are are not determined by what is just, fair, equitable, honest, nor by what Jesus would do. Rights are determined ONLY by what you can DEMAND.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dixie View Post
    Yes, health clinics do provide preventative care, that is why they were built. Any hospital in America is required by law to treat emergency cases, regardless of ability to pay.
    Yeah and it overloads the emergency rooms and costs lots more money.

    I took a friend to an emergency room about a month ago 6 hurs later we saw a DR.
    Yeah the system works so well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackascoal View Post
    Do you have Obama underwear, an Obama nightlite, or do you sleep with a big ol' Obama teddy?

    “I am absolutely determined that by the end of the first term of the next president, we should have universal health care in this country,”

    Who said that?

    I'm not going to argue this silly shit with you. What he said was the we should have universal care, not that he was proposing a plan for universal healthcare or that he was promising to enact universal healthcare.

    What he proposed in his campaign was not universal healthcare. As I said, it was the key distinguishing feature between his healthcare plan and those of Clinton and Edwards, was discussed numerous times in the primary debates, was a key issue of contention between the primary opponents and was one of the reasons Edwards waited so long to endorse a candidate: he thought Obama's plan was shitty.

    You can pretend what you want to pretend though. I have no delusions of changing your mind.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dixie View Post
    There are Russian warships currently off the coast of Venezuela, India and Pakistan are threatening to to play a game of Nuclear Tag, Iran has vowed to destroy Israel, and Russia is acting more and more like the former Soviet Union, but you think this is a good time to cut our military budget because we don't need bombers? People like you give me a headache! It's amazing to me this country has survived as long as it has!
    Yeah, Russian warships that are at least 20 years old and with outdated technologies.

    India and Pakistan playing nucear tag will either set off a worldwide nuclear war or it won't. If it does, have a dozen fewer bombers and fighter aircraft won't make a difference. If it doesn't, having a dozen fewer bombers and fighter aircraft won't make a difference either.

    Iran (and every other radical islamic nation) vowed to wipe Israel out back in the 60s and have been chanting that same mantra ever since. Do you really think that we couldn't wipe Iran flat with a tenth of our aircraft and weapons?

    Russia is making noise. The old USSR wasn't able to do what they bragged about, and that has become more and more clear since they fell. Now you think we should continue the arms race against a nation that is just a fraction of what the USSR was?




    Dixie, we have enough aircraft and warships to wipe any nation off the map. China MIGHT give us some trouble, but short of using nukes no one else can.

    And yet you want to continue to build a bigger and bigger arsenal? What the fuck for??? So we can continue to play global policeman and pretend that we are the good guys in white hats protecting the innocents of the world from the dastardly bad guys?

    I am not saying we should downsize our fleets. But if we cut the GROWTH of our aircraft and warship fleets we could pay for the entire healthcare system.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dungheap View Post
    I'm not going to argue this silly shit with you. What he said was the we should have universal care, not that he was proposing a plan for universal healthcare or that he was promising to enact universal healthcare.

    What he proposed in his campaign was not universal healthcare. As I said, it was the key distinguishing feature between his healthcare plan and those of Clinton and Edwards, was discussed numerous times in the primary debates, was a key issue of contention between the primary opponents and was one of the reasons Edwards waited so long to endorse a candidate: he thought Obama's plan was shitty.

    You can pretend what you want to pretend though. I have no delusions of changing your mind.
    Pretend?

    "I am absolutely determined that by the end of the first term of the next president, we should have universal health care in this country"

    Is he or is he not the "next president?"

    Did he or did he not say "universal healthcare" by the end of the first term of the "next president?"

    It doesn't matter to me that you don't want to discuss it .. that's your perogative brother.

    I'm just pointing out the truth .. and backing it up with his own words.

    Maybe I should have said "His"
    AMERICAN HISTORY ITSELF IS A TESTAMENT TO THE STRENGTH AND RESILIENCE OF AFRICAN PEOPLE. WE, ALONG WITH THE COURGE AND SACRIFICES OF CONSCIOUS WHITE AMERICANS, LIKE VIOLA LIUZZO, EVERETT DIRKSEN, AND MANY OTHERS, HAVE FOUGHT AND DIED TOGETHER FOR OUR FREEDOM, AND FOR OUR SURVIVAL.

    In America, rights are are not determined by what is just, fair, equitable, honest, nor by what Jesus would do. Rights are determined ONLY by what you can DEMAND.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Solitary View Post
    With the economy tanking at record speeds, not having the money may not be a claim. It may be the truth.

    Maybe the idea is to get more people unemployed and without insurance, then a flu epidemic can wipe out more people, reducing the resources needed to keep us going.
    But idiotstick. We never have the money, but some reason that doesn't matter when it's time for war or bailing out bankers. I guess some actions and some people are just more important than others. Some are too big to fail, the rest of us are too small to succeed I guess.

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    Quote Originally Posted by uscitizen View Post
    Yeah and it overloads the emergency rooms and costs lots more money.

    I took a friend to an emergency room about a month ago 6 hurs later we saw a DR.
    Yeah the system works so well.
    You want to see how we can turn 6 hrs into 12 hrs? Legislate universal health care, and that is what you will get, only, it will not be confined to emergency rooms, it will be the case with routine doctor visits and hospital stays as well. It's the reason more foreigners come to the US for medical care than any other nation in the world, they can't get the care they need in their own countries, they have waiting lists for routine surgeries.

    I'm all for "fixing the system" but what you are advocating would destroy the system! Take some of that pork we handed the wooden arrow industry in the $700 billion bailout package, and upgrade state health clinics! I'm fine with that! Reform the TORT laws and stop allowing these ambulance-chasing lawyers advertise on TV night and day, so they can sue the medical industry into bankruptcy with frivolous lawsuits! That would bring down the cost! Hell, allocate Waterhead's mythical $80 billion for health education programs, I'll go along with it, but you can't nationalize health care in this country without destroying the quality of health care we now enjoy. It's just not possible in the real world.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackascoal View Post
    Pretend?

    "I am absolutely determined that by the end of the first term of the next president, we should have universal health care in this country"

    Is he or is he not the "next president?"

    Did he or did he not say "universal healthcare" by the end of the first term of the "next president?"

    It doesn't matter to me that you don't want to discuss it .. that's your perogative brother.

    I'm just pointing out the truth .. and backing it up with his own words.

    Maybe I should have said "His"

    I guess the difference here is what he considers universal and what others consider universal (seriously). He calls his plan universal but it does not have a mandate for all individuals to be covered. Instead his plan purports to make it affordable for every one to get coverage. That is, there is no reason not to have universal coverage other than people not getting insurance.

    Personally, I think his definition is shit. Either you mandate coverage for everyone and your plan is universal or you don't and don't have a universal plan. In my view, his plan is not and never was for universal health insurance. It his view, it is.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AssHatZombie View Post
    But idiotstick. We never have the money, but some reason that doesn't matter when it's time for war or bailing out bankers. I guess some actions and some people are just more important than others. Some are too big to fail, the rest of us are too small to succeed I guess.
    How come when republicans said we didn't have the money democrats called that bullshit.

    If a republican said that today democrats would call it bullshit.

    I'm starting to believe Obama is the messiah and turn bullshit into fine wine.
    AMERICAN HISTORY ITSELF IS A TESTAMENT TO THE STRENGTH AND RESILIENCE OF AFRICAN PEOPLE. WE, ALONG WITH THE COURGE AND SACRIFICES OF CONSCIOUS WHITE AMERICANS, LIKE VIOLA LIUZZO, EVERETT DIRKSEN, AND MANY OTHERS, HAVE FOUGHT AND DIED TOGETHER FOR OUR FREEDOM, AND FOR OUR SURVIVAL.

    In America, rights are are not determined by what is just, fair, equitable, honest, nor by what Jesus would do. Rights are determined ONLY by what you can DEMAND.

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    With the rhetoric our leader, many of our fine citizens, and some religious leaders as well used against Chavez. Well who but an idiot would expect him to love us? Who else would have the balls to side with him except Russia. You are either with us or against us remember ?

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