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Thread: Prove God Exists and Win $10,000.00!

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    Default Prove God Exists and Win $10,000.00!

    Who was the miserable little Atheist who used to post this challenge? I have been racking my brain trying to remember him. He has probably ended his pathetic life by now, but his challenge lives on in my mind.

    My first instinct was to issue a counter-challenge of $10 million if he could scientifically prove God didn't exist. Of course, it is a stupid and pointless challenge either way, because it is impossible. You may as well offer $10,000 to make a cow jump over the moon.

    Still, the basic idea of the challenge is to provoke a response, to have pro-God people actually say something the Atheist can repudiate. So, I never took the obvious bait. But I did ponder the question of how to build a case for existence of God, as a valid and possible theory. In light of current debates on whether we should teach Intelligent Design, it seems an appropriate theory to consider.

    First, we must agree, Science is mandated to question the very things we may think are impossible, our personal opinions have no validity to Science. Because a person happens to not believe we were created by an intelligent designer, has no effect on Science and shouldn't prejudice findings of Science in any way. We must also agree, science does not determine absolutes, it can't prove or disprove creation, evolution, or any other potential theory for origins of life. Keeping an open mind is of the utmost importance, and it is very difficult for Atheists to keep an open mind, when it comes to the possibility of an Intelligent Designer.

    Let's have a look at some scientific evidence to support the possibilities of Intelligent Design.

    1. The failure of Darwin's Theory.
    One of the most obvious facts is the failure of Darwin's Theory to adequately explain origin of life. The theory was established at the turn of the 20th century, and has endured as the definitive theory of Atheists for how life originated. From a purely Scientific standpoint, the theory has been found to have incredible flaws, with the advent of macro-biology and the discovery of DNA, much more is known about our species and others, and there is no evolutionary connection between many various forms of life on the planet. While Darwin's theory may explain "adaptation" of species to various conditions, there is absolutely no scientific evidence to support cross-species evolution of anything, ever.

    2. Natural Selection's Validity.
    One aspect of Darwin's theory, the Theory of Natural Selection, actually supports the scientific theory of Intelligent Design. In Darwin's Natural Selection theory, animals retain attributes conducive with survival, and are 'selected' over animals which do not retain the attributes. Humans have obviously adopted the behavior of worshiping something greater than self. According to NS, this attribute must have been required by our species of life to survive.

    3. Human Behavioral Psychology
    As much a "science" as biology or chemistry, the study of animal behavior subscribes to the same scientific methods and principles of other sciences, and it is here that we find the most compelling evidence for intelligent design. We know and understand, by repeated studies and observations of all kinds of animals and life forms in general, they all display behavior for a reason. Nothing behaves in any way that is without purpose or reason. It may take us time to determine the reason, and it may sometimes appear there is no logical reason, but science can always conclude and rely on this to be the case. That being said, humans have always exhibited the behavior of worship. From the most ancient civilizations we've discovered, we find evidence of some kind of spiritual ritual. Through centuries of wars and oppression, mankind has held fast to the behavior of worship. We know for a fact, any animal exhibiting a routine behavior, has a fundamental purpose for that behavior, therefore, we must conclude there is fundamental purpose for human worship and spirituality.

    4. Ockham's razor
    It is a principle attributed to the 14th-century English logician, William of Ockham. The principle states that the explanation of any phenomenon should make as few assumptions as possible, eliminating those that make no difference in the observable predictions of the explanatory hypothesis or theory. The simplest explanation for the origin of life is an intelligent designer. All other theories require many assumptions and can be quite complicated.

    5. Patterns are not random.
    The unique complexity of life in every form, is defined by DNA, an essential blueprint for every living thing. In the study of DNA structures, we see the patterns of design. We can observe various components of living things and find advanced engineering, things that would have been impossible to develop through the evolution process, because the components function together in an engineered, machine-like manner. This structural design is not likely to have happened randomly, and science would indicate this is virtually impossible to have happened randomly.

    6. Laws of Random Odds.
    In the physical universe of which we live, the basic laws of random odds apply to virtually everything. In order to accept Evolution as the valid explanation for the origin of all life, we must suspend the laws of random odds. There are dozens of things which had to happen in a certain order, to a certain degree, and in a certain way, for the Earth to even be conducive for life. The sheer odds of this should be apparent to anyone who has a look around our solar system and known universe, we seem to be the only place where life exists, anywhere nearby. So, just the miracle of physics which enable life to even exist, are beyond the limits of possibility with random odds. Furthermore, the existence of the vast array of life, in all the billions of forms, and millions of varieties, each add to the stretching of these limits. It is simply a physical impossibility that it all happened randomly.

    7. The Moon
    Without the Moon, it is most likely, no life could exist on this planet. The Moon is responsible (through its collision with Earth) for the rotational wobble of the planet, giving us 4 distinct seasons. Without the seasons, we would have no plant life, and with no plant life, we would have nothing to produce oxygen and enable other life to exist. It is also responsible for ocean tides, which enable all sea life to exist, and acts as a gyroscope to keep the Earth from spinning out of control, off its axis.

    8. Hydrogen, Oxygen, Nitrogen, Carbon.
    The elements of the Universe which enable life to exist. These elements are present throughout our universe, but they happened to come together in the correct proportions on this planet, to enable life to flourish. We have no scientific explanation or theory on where these elements came from, why they exist, or what caused the Big Bang.

    9. Mankind's Amusing Arrogance.
    For whatever reason, mankind has always assumed it knew almost everything, at any given time in history. Even in this advanced technological age, we remain arrogant to the fact that we are ignorant in the scope of the universe. There are trillions of unanswered questions, billions of them we are too ignorant to even ask at this point. We are like babies in a cradle in the middle of a dark room, we know our cradle well, and we know we are in a room, some of it we can identify, but beyond the darkness, we have no knowledge or understanding whatsoever. We relate to things on human terms, within our own infantile understanding of the universe around us, when there may be thousands of dimensions we are unaware of, and many things we can't even comprehend in our small dimension of existence.

    10. The Unexplained.
    Numerous anomalies we have discovered to exist, that science simply can't provide any explanation for. Discovery of the Hobbit people, small humans which lived after the supposed "evolution" of Homo sapiens . In all of the evolution studies, there has never been an explanation for creatures like the giraffe, and animal which seemingly has no evolutionary ancestor, it has always been a giraffe.

    Now.... None of this "proves" God exists. As we established to start with, that is an impossible task, but it does provide a sufficient amount of scientifically based evidence to support a rational theory, the theory of intelligent design.

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    Are you here all week? Do you mind if I skip the veal but try the beef? No need to worry about the waitress, I know she's on minimum wage, I'll make sure she's tipped well.

    This is hilarious!
    Dumbarse and learning to live with it.

    How about you?

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    1/3
    * Annoy a Republican, think for yourself.
    * Annoy a Democrat, support yourself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Diuretic View Post
    Are you here all week? Do you mind if I skip the veal but try the beef? No need to worry about the waitress, I know she's on minimum wage, I'll make sure she's tipped well.

    This is hilarious!
    Soooo, dixie is new to you? Oh my, you have missed a great deal Diuretic!!!! He is quite amusing, most all of the time! A Rebel Rouser lol

    Care

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackflag View Post
    1/3
    divide by zero.
    Excellence is an art won by training and habituation. We do not act rightly because we have virtue or excellence, but rather we have those because we have acted rightly. We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit.
    - -- Aristotle

    Believe nothing on the faith of traditions, even though they have been held in honor for many generations and in diverse places. Do not believe a thing because many people speak of it. Do not believe on the faith of the sages of the past. Do not believe what you yourself have imagined, persuading yourself that a God inspires you. Believe nothing on the sole authority of your masters and priests. After examination, believe what you yourself have tested and found to be reasonable, and conform your conduct thereto.
    - -- The Buddha

    It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.
    - -- Aristotle

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    Hes one of those people you just have to wonder how does he function in life when he gets everything so wrong all the time yet continually insists he his the all knowing all seeing greatest mind of our time.

    Hes like BB with the ability to try and make it look like he knows what hes talking about.

    there is not one shread of evidence that one being created everything. It still leaves you with who created the one being.

    Space and all its contents just are. Why people have to think there was some beinging is beyond me. What ever begining theory leaves you with a what came boefore that question. So even in Ockham's razor thought the simplest answer is that space and its contents have always exsisted.

    We are finite beings and live a life of beginings and endings. Its hard for our soon to not exsist emotional minds to wrap arround the idea but it is the most logical solution to what some see as the big question. Science leaves all people with the fact that energy can not be destroyed only transformed. Take heart all because you will never be destroyed just completely transformed into something else. In time even in science the matter that makes you up will be part of the cycle forever.

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    Is there ONE FACT about the existence of a God?

    Is there ANYTHING in the bible that Man didn't already know?

    Any chapter on DNA?

    Why didn't God know slavery is ungodly and speak against it instead of instructing people how to do it?

    What dixie claims as "evidence" is for stupid people who have no understanding of science or why most scientists don't believe in God.

    Hey dixie .. if someone in your family faces a life-threatening illness, make sure you take them to church to cure them .. don't take them to medicine, doctors, and hospitals .. they use science.
    AMERICAN HISTORY ITSELF IS A TESTAMENT TO THE STRENGTH AND RESILIENCE OF AFRICAN PEOPLE. WE, ALONG WITH THE COURGE AND SACRIFICES OF CONSCIOUS WHITE AMERICANS, LIKE VIOLA LIUZZO, EVERETT DIRKSEN, AND MANY OTHERS, HAVE FOUGHT AND DIED TOGETHER FOR OUR FREEDOM, AND FOR OUR SURVIVAL.

    In America, rights are are not determined by what is just, fair, equitable, honest, nor by what Jesus would do. Rights are determined ONLY by what you can DEMAND.

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    Default Obsessed with BB I see...

    Quote Originally Posted by Desh View Post
    Hes one of those people you just have to wonder how does he function in life when he gets everything so wrong all the time yet continually insists he his the all knowing all seeing greatest mind of our time.

    Hes like BB with the ability to try and make it look like he knows what hes talking about.

    there is not one shread of evidence that one being created everything. It still leaves you with who created the one being.

    Space and all its contents just are. Why people have to think there was some beinging is beyond me. What ever begining theory leaves you with a what came boefore that question. So even in Ockham's razor thought the simplest answer is that space and its contents have always exsisted.

    We are finite beings and live a life of beginings and endings. Its hard for our soon to not exsist emotional minds to wrap arround the idea but it is the most logical solution to what some see as the big question. Science leaves all people with the fact that energy can not be destroyed only transformed. Take heart all because you will never be destroyed just completely transformed into something else. In time even in science the matter that makes you up will be part of the cycle forever.

    fyi...BB has forgotten more than desheepoo will ever know...'end of story' and desheepoos diatribe!
    Not to mention..reading your diatribes is akin to watching cement set...really boring!
    Last edited by Battleborne; 05-26-2008 at 12:31 PM.

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    A couple of points you made need to be corrected, Dixie.

    #1 - The failure of Darwin's theory to explain the origins of life

    Darwin's theory never attempted to explain the origins of life. His theories (for they are actually several separate theories) have never addressed the origins of life at all. You might try reading his theories before attacking them.


    #2 - Natural Selection is Intelligent design

    Nothing could be further from the truth. Natural Selection does not involve any diety or intelligent design. It simply states that an animal that is better able to survive and multiply will eventually replace animals that are less able to survive and multiply.


    #3 - Patterns are not random.

    This idea that certain biological systems could not have evolved due to their complex and interconnected nature is simply false. Most often, the Intelligent Design proponents point to the human eye. They claim it is so complex, and relies on all its parts to function. This can only be valid if you ignore the myriad of examples of simpler and less complex "eyes" in the animal world. From the eye spots on planeria (which are only light sensitive) to our eyes, there are a multitude of steps that are simpler and still function.


    #4 - The Moon

    Your suggestion that the seasons (provided by the moon) allow plant life, and without the seasons there would be no plant life is patently ridiculous. There are no seasons at the equator. And yet, the plant and animal life is more abundant there than anywhere else on the planet. South Florida has very little seasonal change, and yet the undeveloped landscape is a veritable jungle.


    #5 - Hydrogen, Oxygen, Nitrogen, and Carbon

    Your supposition here only works if you accept that life came about BECAUSE of the elements. The other side of the coin is that life came about and made use of the common elements available. But again, you are discussing the origins of life, not the theory of evolution.

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    There are so many flaws with this that I don't know where to begin. I've decided I'm not going to.
    "Do not think that I came to bring peace... I did not come to bring peace, but a sword." - Matthew 10:34

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    I almost forgot one.

    The tides do not enable all sea life to survive. The tides allow a small portion of sea life, living at the very edge of the oceans, to survive. The overwhelming majority of sea life is uneffected by the tides.

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    I really just can't stand this one though:

    "4. Ockham's razor
    It is a principle attributed to the 14th-century English logician, William of Ockham. The principle states that the explanation of any phenomenon should make as few assumptions as possible, eliminating those that make no difference in the observable predictions of the explanatory hypothesis or theory. The simplest explanation for the origin of life is an intelligent designer. All other theories require many assumptions and can be quite complicated."

    The very notion of an infinitely complex designer spinning out of nowhere and then randomly designing a universe is absurd. It is far more complex than a universe coming out of nowhere, because it requires two steps (Designer coming out of nowhere to design a universe that came from nowhere) instead of one (universe came out of nowhere).
    "Do not think that I came to bring peace... I did not come to bring peace, but a sword." - Matthew 10:34

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    Watermark's comments are right on the money.

    The idea that a theory is scientific when it revolves around a central power, about which there is not one shred of scientific evidence renders the theory null and void.

    Intelligent Design is a BELIEF, not a scientific theory.

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    Default Who is this masked man...Solitary?

    'Hi ho silver'!!!...he(could be a she...Rangerette) must be the 'Lone Ranger'...Kimosabe ***sneaks***off into the wilderness!

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    Who is this Solitary?

    He is just a guy wandering the information highway in search of intelligent conversation and intellectual stimulation.

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